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Thread: Service Manual Error Log With Corrections

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    MI, USA
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    3,451

    Service Manual Error Log With Corrections

    Getting tired of running into the same invalid info in service manuals, so I'm making this post for a sanity check for myself, but why not share it with the world too. Most of the issues I've found have been wire pinout/color related. I mainly use the Honda Branded service manuals. This is open for anyone to add corrections though, but please be detailed (brand, exact service manual/machines it covers, page number, correction etc). Screen shots are nice but not required. Ignore my quick paint edits, it's intended to be functional, not pretty lol.

    I know there was a 200 series error for which spark plug it called for too, can't remember which one it was. The wiring based errors I'll add as I run across them.


    Found Errors:

    (Link) 84 ATC200ES Big Red - Pg:226 CDI Pinout Incorrect
    (Link) 84 TRX200 - Pg:250 CDI Pinout Incorrect
    Last edited by ps2fixer; 04-13-2019 at 05:48 PM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    MI, USA
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    3,451
    84 Official Honda Shop Manual ATC Big Red ATC200ES
    Pg:226
    Error: CDI Pinout Incorrect, black and black/red pins are reversed, validated with an 84 ATC200ES harness

    Corrections in image are in red.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails pg226 CDI Pinout.jpg  
    Last edited by ps2fixer; 04-13-2019 at 05:43 PM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    MI, USA
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    3,451
    84 Official Honda Shop Manual TRX200
    Pg:250
    Error: CDI Pinout Incorrect, black and black/red pins are reversed, validated with an 84 ATC200ES harness, and CDI interchange to 84 TRX200

    Corrections in image are in red.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails pg250 CDI Pinout.jpg  

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Northeast
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    16,983
    Very interesting...
    WHO IS Q?? WWG1WGA!!


    86 ATC200X Flatrack ( I may not be fast but this is one FAST 200X!!

    86 ATC350X Motocross, 86 ATC452X Flatrack!!

    07 Weekend Warrior Toy Hauler

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Location
    TN
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    1,030
    There are all kind of errors in the wiring diagrams for the 200 E & ES.
    Fixer and I have ran into a few along the way while fixing my junk.

    For instance, take the 200E. According to the Honda manual, the ignition switch is 4 wires: Black, green, red & yellow/red
    BUT the Clymer manual lists it as Black, Dark green, Red & red/white as does the wiring diagram you find on 3 Wheeler Worlds home page. I'm assuming the two are one in the same.
    Cylmer & 3ww diagrams also do not even show the DC consent fuse or it's wiring. ...and that throws the relay outta whack.. The relay is shown in Clymer/3WW diagrams as going from the relay to the (1) starter button and (2) ignition & lighting switch but according to the Honda manual, it's routed through the consent fuse with (obviously) different colored wiring.


    I'm still learning the nit-picky details of the ATC200 line of wiring. While each model is different, there are commonalities they all share in the basic design and function. If you're diving into it for the first time, it can be VERY frustrating.


    Also, for the 200ES; Information on the neutral inhibitor switch is all but non-existent. Kings to Ps2Fixer for tackling that riddle and offering a solution.
    I was born and raised on Venus & I may be here a while.....

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    MI, USA
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    3,451
    Yea, the relay functions and such aren't documented too well in the service manuals, with a good standardization of symbols, it would be pretty easy to document normally open vs normally closed etc.

    For the 200E ignition switch wire issue, sounds like the 3ww/Clymer manual is the one that's incorrect. That's basing it on the ATC200ES ignition switch, and using the part number for interchange to the 82-83 ATC200E. Partzilla even has a photo validating the colors. I also make/resell an ignition switch for the 200E/ES machines as the same part number and wire colors and in around 1000 sales, no one has mentioned a wire color issue etc.

    https://www.partzilla.com/product/ho...4713ff0581d857

    I personally don't trust the Clymer manuals and other 3rd party ones too much, but in theory if they base their data on the Honda service manual, they have the opportunity to correct invalid info.

    In the long run, I plan to host a site with all service info, hand made wire diagrams that are 100% accurate including showing relay functions etc and having sections for notes and such for each part. Some machines have multi-able part numbers for a single part, and sometimes the differences are quite notable when you need real details. Quick example is the ATC350x exciter coil, there's a high ohms and low ohms version based on which manufacture made the part. The Honda OEM CDI seems to work with both, but for aftermarket, sometimes one can cause problems vs the other. I assume one puts out a higher voltage than the other, so might be a stock performance gain using the higher ohm (in theory higher voltage) stator assembly.

    Talking about the Clymer manuals, are there any online scans of the whole book? If not, a scan of the wire diagram would be useful so I can modify it and post the corrections, or at-least make a note on the photo for easier understanding vs word descriptions.

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