Atc 4 Me

[3WW Star-CoeShow]

Cory,

Pipes are VERY rider specific. What is "awesome" for one, is a dog for others so you will need to do some experimentation to decide what suits your taste.

When I was racing back in the mid eighties, my testing showed that Klemm Research's pipe was the overall "best" power producing pipe (for me). No Paul Turner pipe ever worked as good as others.

The entire PT pipe line were all dogs IMHO.

Of course trying to find a Klemm pipe today would be like finding a needle in a hay stack! Eddie Sanders probably has a good 3 wheeler pipe. I would inform you to get a Sparks Racing pipe but I don't think he makes one for the
ATC250R, only quads.

Good luck and ride safely.

[EAT_A_450]

Mike, thanks for your help what type of race did you run the atac jug on? mx? Was it faster than any ported 250r jug that you ran? I've read where the newer cr-powervalve jugs will fit but you have to do some case mods and bypass the powervalve which gives you plenty of top end but kills the bottom end and I'm hoping that the atac jug won't do that but It's hard to find riders with hands on experience. The only other rider that I talked with about it (I lost contact with) was a dune rider- he said that it would smoke any ported 250r jug in the dunes but I never got to ask him how it ran on bottom end.

[3WW Star-CoeShow]

Cory,

The ATAC cylinder was a good choice over a stock cylinder. It worked far better than a stock ATC cylinder, but the best I ever ran was the Japanese special race cylinders. They were the best overall.

The ATAC cylinder also had a different head sealing design that was somewhat problematic. I had some head gasket issues while using the ATAC cylinder/head. The design was changed in later cylinders, but the newer CR cylinders don't interchange like the 84 ATAC does.

If it where me, I would opt for a modified ATC/quad jug. I feel they are more reliable after being modified and when added compression is used.

Mike

[MTS]

Hey mike,

Just curious if you ever ran the Canadian circuit of the ama trike supercross.....??

[3WW Star-CoeShow]

my trike sucks,

I never raced in Canada, but I did race in Alaska! I raced and won many AMA supercross races. Some of the races were held during the break between motos.

Later on we raced "after" the motorcycle races were over, like at 0-dark thirty and almost all of the spectators had left.

The best combination of mixing bikes and trikes was when we had a race along with the AMA dirt track series.

3 wheelers were much better suited to that type of track. When we raced at the Supercross races the 3 wheelers were laughed at more than appreciated. When watching a 3 wheeler limp around a worn/grooved out track after watching the bikes do the triple jumps, it's no wonder!

When we raced the flat track and TT tracks, the 3 wheelers ran equal and better lap times than the bikes! The spectators loved it!

I don't know why the AMA never combined the two series. Maybe the 2 wheeled dirt track racers felt the 3 wheelers would put on an even better show.......

I would come out of retirement if they ever held an ATV race at the AMA Peoria TT. Have you ever seen that race?
It used to be awesome! I don't know if it's still on the circuit, but many would race and win on MX bikes fitted with dirt track tires because the jumps were so big!

Good luck and ride safely.

[Dammit!]

Cory,

The ATAC cylinder was a good choice over a stock cylinder. It worked far better than a stock ATC cylinder, but the best I ever ran was the Japanese special race cylinders. They were the best overall.

The ATAC cylinder also had a different head sealing design that was somewhat problematic. I had some head gasket issues while using the ATAC cylinder/head. The design was changed in later cylinders, but the newer CR cylinders don't interchange like the 84 ATAC does.

If it where me, I would opt for a modified ATC/quad jug. I feel they are more reliable after being modified and when added compression is used.

Mike

I thought it was the 1985 CR250 cylinder that swapped onto the trike. Are you sure it's the 1984?

[Billy Golightly]

Hey Mike, you might have already seen these but if you haven't I thought you might enjoy seeing my 500R short track racer I built over the winter. I finished it up in March, ran a couple races with it and really pleased with it. 90% of the fab work is my own, including the pipe sectioning (Kinda dirty, but it was the first one I'd ever done). I wonder how much this would have been like the real ATC500R? Fun to think about.

[wildman]

Hello mike I have a question I just bought a couple 82 250r's one has a liquid cooled head that says leckich tuning, i took it to the machine shop and they said it was a 500 the guy i bought it from said he thought it was a 400 have you ever heard of leckich tuning ?

[EAT_A_450]

Mike,
you mentioned a hi wax seat as a mod- what exactly is a hi wax seat? Oh and I went with an Eddie Sanders 310 instead of the atac!

thanks again,
Cory

[3wlrtxn]

Hey Mike, did you ever race in the AstroDome in Houston, I raced ATC's around TX. and I've heard your name before I think we even met in AZ. onec, did you race in the Micky Thomson sieres I did that tour in 86 I was 16 at the time.
after that I went on to race quads.

[3WW Star-CoeShow]

Gentlemen,

I will try to answer the last questions as they were posted. Sorry I haven't logged on lately, but much is happening as of late.

Damnit,
I don't think that the 1985 CR cylinder will "bolt-on" to the ATC lower end. If memory serves, the bolt pattern was slightly changed. The ATAC cylinder (84?) was a direct fit.

Billy,
Your creation is likely very similar to what Honda was contemplating. The only "racer" to ever ride the trike was Marty Hart. Team Honda was allowed to disassemble and take critical measurements of the frame and other components as there were significant changes.

We incorporated many of the improved geometry numbers into our production ATC250 frames for improved handling capability.

Wildman,
Leckich does sound familiar but I do not recall what they marketed.

Eat_a_450,
The seat in question was a seat that incorporated a MUCH thicker foam section along with the corresponding seat cover, similar to the ones you see used on mini/pit bikes used for adults. One of the Team Honda riders, Mark Weixeldorfer (Wax for short) marketed these seats along with others. We always supported Wax. I hope that is the info you're looking for.

3wlrtxn,

I did race in the AstroDome! I raced in Texas many times through the years. I also competed in and won many Mickey Thompson events, but never followed the entire series to win the championship as Team Honda raced in many different areas and tracks. The only Mickey Thompson events I competed in were in California.

Honda also would not compete on the "Traveling Circus" that employed portable steel ramps for jumps that were built on concrete racing surfaces that Mickey Thompson promoted in many cities. I will add that Mickey and Trudy Thompson were close to me. They treated me like their son. They were awesome folks.
Like you, I also began racing quads in 1986 as the ATC team had been disbanded except for one 3 wheeler rider, Marty Hart, and one 4trax rider, Steve Wright. There was NO Team Honda is 1987. I had a Pro Support deal from Suzuki in 1986 where I won many races on an experimental LT250. I then signed with Yamaha for the 1986 Baja 1000 where the "Banshee" was introduced. The Banshee's finished 1-2, beating Team Honda.

I raced for Yamaha through the 1988 season when I retired from Professional ATV racing. Yamaha informed me they were pulling the plug at the end of 1988. I was likely the last "Full Factory" ATV racer thanks to support from Yamaha.

[BenSchlimme]

Wow!!! So just doing some reminiscing with some random internet searching on ATC250R's and stumble across this thread with Mike Coe.

Spent the day reading all the posts to get caught up and glad to see some of the old timers are still posting - Mike, Brett & Dean K.

Mike, I am "former" ATC racer a few years younger then you but raced the '85-'86 AATVA Nationals in the Amateur class on my Honda ATC250R when I was 16 & 17. I didn't do all the races but in '86 I finished I think 3 or 4th behind Charlie Sheppard, Donnie Wilson and think it was Alan Mathis maybe 3rd.

My first national was at Porterville, CA in 1985. I think that was the year that you, Mike had a pretty big get off at the end of the front stretch and came back with a pretty wadded axle and helmet. May have a picture of that one but bet you really don't want to see it.

Had a great time watching the pros like Mike, Curtis, Marty and Rodney kick some serious tail on the competition. It was cool to finally learn that I was right, in Columbus Ohio for one for the nationals(20 second laps), that the funky frame Marty was running was NOT stock. You could see it was not stock but I thought AATVA at the time mandated it. Anyway, Marty and Jimmy tangled over the one jump and I thought blows were going to happen.

Interesting stories about all the politics. I was just a small town kid from Tucson that would go to the races in a truck with my dad and I did all my wrenching and setup. I felt fortunate to get some help from Paul Turner at the time in the form of his "trick" welded up transfer port cylinder for my 1985(still have that one in a box in my shop) and for me on my '86 I had one of the CR cylinders that was a rocket. Pulled the hole shot on the entire amateur filed in the AATVA San Antonio National in 1986 with that ATC and at the time Charlie Sheppard was supposed to be Paul's sponsored amateur but he didn't have one!! Last race he didn't. I think these did use the 85 CR cylinder with the small power valve chamber on the top of the cylinder not the big ATAC chamber like you are talking about Mike. Paul plugged the chamber with a machined aluminum piece. It was the fastest 3-wheeler I ever ridden but maybe would have been faster if Paul didn't port it. Grenaded that cylinder when I started running pro at a National at the LA Fairgrounds in 1986 and never ran the same.

I raced my 3-wheeler longer then most into 1986 in . Jumped on a quad late in 1986 and mainly did the Mickey's & SCORE in 1987. Highlight was a 250CC Class 24 win at the Baja 1000 with John Herder and Steve Melton. Then it was off to college in 1987. Big Parker 400 overall with John Herder in Class 24 for 1988 and a just over 50mph average. Think I got 5 or 6 Parker wins in total over the years. Back into quad racing from 1991 to 1995 in the SCORE and D38 events, teaming with Lance Schoonmaker late in my career in SCORE, then off to desert car racing(Class 10 and 1) in SCORE from then.

Mike - didn't you do a local Phoenix race at Manzanita speedway back in 1985 I think? I think I have a picture of you from that race that I need to dig up. We had some fast local ATC rider out of Phx with Tommy Brown and John Savinski then Greg Clark on the Suzuki Quad.

It's great to read about some of the behind the scenes guys I remember idolizing back in the day.

Brett - do you ever remember a guy named Mike Hayes I believe? He lived in Tucson back in the late 80's and I think new you. He "raced" a bit and somehow had a pretty good JT hook-up(probably you!!).

I've got many more stories but not quite as well known as Mike's and Brett's!!!

[NOS_350X]

My first national was at Porterville, CA in 1985. I think that was the year that you, Mike had a pretty big get off at the end of the front stretch and came back with a pretty wadded axle and helmet. May have a picture of that one but bet you really don't want to see it.

Porterville, Too bad they dont still have races there. You got any pictures from there? Its close to me so it adds a little more.

[BenSchlimme]

Porterville, Too bad they dont still have races there. You got any pictures from there? Its close to me so it adds a little more.

Porterville was crazy fast and a quality track. 6th gear final corner left for no more gears down the front stretch. I remember telling Rob Selvy that I could not pull 6th through the final turn with the gear I had, which many were running, probably 15/35 or 16/35.

He told me you should be in 5th in that corner anyway!!

I also remember I guy in an Odyssey that going down the front stretch would rock back and forth really hard. Looked totally goofy but by the end of the straight he could pull 1/2 to 1 length on the next guy!

Let me see if I can dig up my old pictures. I know I have some shots of me and also a shot of Selvy and his "crew". Just hope the wife didn't "donate" them to the dump.

I think I raced Porterville 2x but maybe I am dreaming. I remember the amateur race there was so mismanaged. We were lining up for the 250A main at something like 3:30AM believe it or not.

[3WW Star-CoeShow]

Ben,

Been a while since I last logged on! I did get off hard at Porterville. I actually totaled my trike. My mechanic Chuck Miller, who is now the Honda Race Team Manager, had to rebuilt it with a new frame up. Frame was toast, forks, swingarm, axle, everything was bent!

Chuck said that during one of the many flips that the trike was over 20 feet in the air. I was lucky to have not been seriously injured!

That sweeper at the end of the main straight netted speeds over 70 MPH (for my slow Paul Turner equipped trike) I know Eddie Sanders had at least 10 MPH on me there, but I think his engine expired early on.

During practice I remember I was all tucked in heading down the long straight trying to get everything I could out of my trike. Eddie Sanders pulls up along side of me sitting up straight, guns his trike a few times, and then easily pulls away and grabs another gear!! I was topped out! The engine I had there at Porterville was a DOG, as were most of my Paul Turner equipped trikes. I only ever had one that ran to my liking.

I had to race the last chance qualifier after the crash to qualify for the main. I believe I won the last chance qualifier which allowed me "choice" of the last row for the start. Even starting in the back I believe I finished 3rd or 4th in the main event.

On the flat tracks a fast machine was much more important than on the off-road tracks. I wish I could have run my DG prepared top ends!! I did have faster stuff from DG. Too bad I couldn't run DG Performance in 85.

Paul Turner could make fast stuff, but he focused solely on Marty Hart and catered to Marty's desires. I mentioned this before, but all I got to choose from for engine performance back then were Marty's cast-offs. They would test for days and keep the "good stuff". Chuck and I got the left-overs! Real "Teamwork". HA!!

People often asked me what it was like during that "get-off" at Porterville. That was the worst crash in my entire racing career. The best way I could describe it was to tell them, "If you want to know, get in the back of a pickup truck and jump out at 70MPH". That will give you a good idea!

Mike