Bad Bad Smoke

[Mucker-1]

Hi
Ive just bought a tri z 250 very very cheap too good to miss out on,but i seem to have a big problem with it,I started it up it fired first time but then thick smoke coming out of the muffler,Sooo i unscrewed the dranage plug wating for the old oil to pour out but all that came out was about half a cup full of thick grey gunge! so i filled it up with new oil plus redex engine flush,I ran it for about ten mins then unscrewed the engine plug again Emptied out all the old oil and the engine flush and topped it up with new oil,fired it up,Still think grey smoke choking me....can anyone help me please ? whats the next step? do i take off the head and put new rings in ?would this do the trick or is the problem much more Serious .apart from this the bike seems in good shape.

[DeePa]

tri-z is a 2 stroke, expect smoke

[Russell 350X]

What kind of oil did you use? Its gonna smoke on cold start-up, its a 2-stroke. After you run it for a few minutes does the smoke clear up? What gas/oil mix are you running?

[1BFC]

Drain all the oil out of the trans and start it up. Does the smoke go away?

If smoke goes away or reduces dramatically, then you have bad crank seal issues and it's time for a bottom end rebuild.

If smoking doesn't go away, there's a lot of things it could be.

[300rman]

waht they said. could be crank seals, could be too rich of a fuel/oil mix.

DO NOT RUN STRAIGHT GAS IN IT< OR YOU TRASH THE MOTOR, as it seems you arent familiar with 2 strokes.

[fabiodriven]

Drain all the oil out of the trans and start it up. Does the smoke go away?

If smoke goes away or reduces dramatically, then you have bad crank seal issues and it's time for a bottom end rebuild.

If smoking doesn't go away, there's a lot of things it could be.

Ummmm, I definately wouldn't start the trike without oil in the trans. Even if you're not riding it, there's still alot of stuff spinning around in there. Not the best advice I've ever heard...

[Mucker-1]

waht they said. could be crank seals, could be too rich of a fuel/oil mix.

DO NOT RUN STRAIGHT GAS IN IT< OR YOU TRASH THE MOTOR, as it seems you arent familiar with 2 strokes.

I know you get smoke with 2 strokes but this is going over board...and im not running it on straight gas,The mix is 20/1

[Brad200X]

Could be a leaking head gasket. Do you hear any bubbling noises coming from the radiator right after you shut the machine down? How about coolant running down the side of the head? More importantly, what does the smoke smell like?

[NewfieBish]

the guy who owned this bike before you thought it was better to burn oil than gas.. drain that sh!t outta the tank and put some nicely mixed 50:1 gas to oil mixture in there and you'll have a bike.. if it got power, but it smokes, it should be as simple as fuel mixture.. is your bike idling weird? when you mix gas wrong it wont idle right.. if your bike is gutless, its a gasket.. good luck

[aldochina]

i'm not sure why no ones mentioned that to begin with there was no oil in the crankcase, just alittle gray sludge!!!!! I dont own any 2 strokes, but something deffinately is not right about that!!

[Thorpe]

Crank seals are trashed....

[factoryX]

crank seals could be blown but does this guy even know what he is doing? It sounds like a normal 2 stroke on the smoke part. also, are you checking fluid in the rads? Bad water seal? need to drain old gas, new spark plug, compression test, carb cleaned, and other little stuff. not the best bike to start out with, especially this bike being that parts are hard to get, also very spendy if you brake something. okay, the oil in the case needed to be replaced.

[ants84olds]

try mixing the gas with less oil like 36:1 or 40:1. 20:1 is way too much oil and could be causing the problem. Could be tons of build up in the pipe with that much oil also.

[factoryX]

yes 20:1 is a bit over.....lol try 32:1

[1BFC]

Ummmm, I definately wouldn't start the trike without oil in the trans. Even if you're not riding it, there's still alot of stuff spinning around in there. Not the best advice I've ever heard...

If you are not running the bike through the gears, then it's perfectly safe to do this. Nothing is moving except the crank and it gets lubricated via the fuel.

Certainly do not drive the machine or run it through the gears while in the air either. It's a simple test you run while standing still.

[fabiodriven]

If you are not running the bike through the gears, then it's perfectly safe to do this. Nothing is moving except the crank and it gets lubricated via the fuel.

Certainly do not drive the machine or run it through the gears while in the air either. It's a simple test you run while standing still.

Not true at all. The crank is connected to the clutch with gears and the clutch is connected to the transmisson. Sorry buddy, but if your engine is running, the bottom end is going as well. Look into it. Nothing good can come from running your engine with no tranny oil.

[1BFC]

No load, residual oil on the gears. You don't run the engine for half an hour.

I get where you are coming from. But seriously, you aren't going to hurt anything doing a short test. I'm not the only one that recommends this type of test either. I actually learned about it here on this forum.

/shrug Take it with a grain of salt! :)

[300rman]

i agree, 32:1 for the fuel/oil mix.

as for the no oil in the trans while running it, it is safe as long as you dont run it too long, and you dont drive it.


first, drain the gas, mix some 32:1 and run it around awhile to see if it clears up. if it doent show ANY signs of improvement, then it could definitely be the crank seals.
make sure you get the motor hot, so after mixing the new gas, run it hard for awhile to get the motor and the pipe hot.

[fabiodriven]

No load, residual oil on the gears. You don't run the engine for half an hour.

I get where you are coming from. But seriously, you aren't going to hurt anything doing a short test. I'm not the only one that recommends this type of test either. I actually learned about it here on this forum.

/shrug Take it with a grain of salt! :)

Yeah, I guess it would probably be OK. I still wouldn't do it though.

[Erics350x]

Not true at all. The crank is connected to the clutch with gears and the clutch is connected to the transmisson. Sorry buddy, but if your engine is running, the bottom end is going as well. Look into it. Nothing good can come from running your engine with no tranny oil.

So pull the clutch lever.........

[Fox250R]

been using klotz 40:1 for 3 years now..Still runs strong as ever..

[fabiodriven]

So pull the clutch lever.........

Everything is still going to spin if you pull the clutch lever just from the natural "drag" in the clutch. You know that that "clunk" when you click it in gear? That is the sound of the gears stopping when they engage. Even if pulling the clutch lever did stop the gears (which it doesn't), the clutch basket would still be turning and your wet clutch would now be engaged "dry". Not to mention the throw out bearing will have pressure on it with no oil on that as well. Just not a great idea no matter how you slice it.

[Yamada]

Also the excessive amount of smoke can be caused by the oil in the silencer. I say take the baffle apart and see how it's look.

[Dirtcrasher]

There are other ways of checking this without running the bottom end dry, even for 20 seconds I wouldn't do it and wouldn't advise it.......

I won't say it would cause detrimental damage, but these things spin a hell of allot faster than ya think!

[factoryX]

this is great info thread, but where is the guy with the messed up tri-z?

[Erics350x]

Everything is still going to spin if you pull the clutch lever just from the natural "drag" in the clutch. You know that that "clunk" when you click it in gear? That is the sound of the gears stopping when they engage. Even if pulling the clutch lever did stop the gears (which it doesn't), the clutch basket would still be turning and your wet clutch would now be engaged "dry". Not to mention the throw out bearing will have pressure on it with no oil on that as well. Just not a great idea no matter how you slice it.

The gears dont spin when the clutch its pulled, assuming the drive line is connected.
I get what your saying though, but for a minute or two its not gonna hurt a thing as long as the engine has been ran recently with oil in it.

The correct way would be to pressure test the crankcase, but draining the oil would be alot easier and faster.

[fabiodriven]

The gears dont spin when the clutch its pulled, assuming the drive line is connected.
.

If left in neutral the gears will absolutely spin even if you pull the clutch. If you put it in gear and hold the clutch the gears will not spin. Even if you have it in gear so the gears are not spinning, you'll still be doing damage to the clutch.

Like I said before, any way you slice it you're going to do damage.

[Nick_R_23]

I think you guys are on the wrong track. He said there was grey sludge in the motor. Grey sludge=water mixed with oil=water is getting in the bottom end somehow. Thats what I would fix first.

-Nick :TrikesOwn

[factoryX]

exactly, but he mentioned something else about the gas tank...idk what he was talking about but this thread should stop if the person who made the thread is not responding.

[Meat-BoX]

Gray oils sludge sounds like milky eye/oil syndrome. AKA water leaking into your lower end thus the syndrome. sucks. My Tecate did that, had to do a new impeller seal I believe. I also moved up to GEAR SAVER SAE 75W from Bel-Ray for the engine instead of normal 10w 30 or 40.