Carb ,Eletrical or Head issue's,Diagnosing ..

[sandpuppi101]

http://i362.photobucket.com/albums/oo64/sandpuppi101/100_7325.jpghttp://i362.photobucket.com/albums/oo64/sandpuppi101/100_7301.jpg

[sandpuppi101]

Something I see alot of are people posting up pic's of there machine's and telling the untold story that it just does'nt wanna run rite and it foul's out plug's,and wanna know..What do I do??

Well I've come into something that I alway's knew to be true ,but here lately i've seen lot's more of it with your pic's,my personal machine's and my own customer's machine's.

To look at that head you really would'nt think much of it ,but look what has happened to the inside of the motor ,especially the piston ,and the head /valve's were just as bad as this also.I'd say that innocent looking ,leaking on the head is a bigger issue than some figure it to be.

I'm gonna post up some more pic's and some more educational info,in a few but I'm just wanting to know,How many of ya's have a motor that is looking like this one?

[sandpuppi101]

http://i362.photobucket.com/albums/oo64/sandpuppi101/100_6351.jpg[IMG]http://i362.photobucket.com/albums/oo64/sandpuppi101/100_7341.jpg[/IMG

I guess I should exclaim that the motor's that I am basically talking about are the Vertical 182-200 type honda motor.These model engine's have ton's of the same symptom's,time and time again and are found in lot's of ATC model's and some 4-trac's also.But this basically applies to a vast array of motor's including all the big factory machine's,including Yamaha ,Kaw's and Suzuki's.

Seperating a engine issue from a carb issue ,can sometime's be a major headache to decifer,but once you've farmilarized yourself with common knowledge and have a referance manual by your side ,it's a process of elimination.

With the head something that get's totally overlooked ,and has been done before by myself is the wear on the cam lobe's.Now honestly how many people have put a motor back together without mic'ing the lobe's.I have and have been burned on it a few time's.I now do it religiously ,with-out thought ,but I have seen and replaced many cam's from being out of spec,or just at tolerance.Best idea is to replace it and have not too deal with it again.Just do it rite the first time.Another thing that is closely associated with the cam is the Cam chain tensioner.Ever wonder why your motor has all that ticking noise.On worn motor's ,it seem's more often than not ,that little tensioner has a crack located down by the cylinder base,on the inside,below the pulse generator.

I know it's lot's of info and I hope that you read this open minded ,because this seem's to be some of the more popular issue's reflecting a motor's performance.

Something I do on basically every gunky,nasty ,yellowed ,stinky ,tarnished carb is spend the money and get a brand new carb kit.It does'nt have to be oem,actually there are is quite the variety of companie's that have these kit's still avaliable. When taking the carb apart ,specifically talking about the jet's,observe and see what the setting were.It's alway's nice to look back on that info when your assembling it.Make sure you have a basic knowledge of the operation,and nothing is sticking or stuck.Key thing's when looking at carb's,are float height,needle seat ,spring's and little rubber o-ring's.The way i look at it ,doing a carb once is OK with me ,but doing it time and time again,or finding that extra piece on the workbench really suck's when you've already put the carb back on the machine.PAY ATTENTION TO DETAIL !!

Figuring out a issue with your machine as far as being a fuel issue,or a timing issue or a internal issue,like I said before can be very easy if you just incorperate ,the process of elimination.Wiring can be a huge nitemare and is sometime's confused as other problem's but with a good OHM meter or soething of the same,you can check switche's at the bar's,check the stator wire's for juice,and work your way to the CDI,thus checking the whole system in a matter of minute's,but soething i've been rolled on and burt really bad on before,is not having a good ground.Especially on a restored machine.

Now I basically just hammered off a list of clue's that I look for when diagnosing a machine,most of the time something I mentioned is the culprate but other's it's not.It just what I do in situation's.I'm also not posting this thinking to myself that I am the best ,or some sort of premoddona,but i am just putting down thing's that took me a long time to learn to make it easier on other's.I see new guy's joining and ask some question's that just make me laugh,I ain't knocking ya's for asking the question's it's just how the question's are asked.I just hope you's can look at this thread and use it as a index of sort,so you's can do a search and find some answer's.

I'd like to hear some feedback on this and I'd also like too see some of the older more experienced member's put there 2 cent's in.because I honesty can't take another heading on a thread that read's.MY ATC DOES"NT RUN,NOW WHAT ??

Let me know what you all think or any thought's..:p

[Daddio]

I for one would like to say thanks Roger. I feel the same way you do.
It would be nice to have a section on this site where guys could go to get good info on the possible causes of some of the more common problems with their "old" machines. I have a long history of fixing mechanical things. I'm no expert on these old machines, I'm usually fixing cars, but over the years I've owned a few and and worked on a lot more.
I will only give advice if I'm pretty sure I can give sound advice.
Some people are better at describing the problem than others and are probably more likely to be able to succeed in repairing their machine without too much help.
Others seem to be totally confused and need all the help they can get and sometimes even that may not be enough.
I think that you need to have a good manual and be familiar with it before tearing into your machines.
I totally agree with you about replacing things that are borderline while you have the thing apart. It may cost a little more but you either pay a little more now or a lot more later.
Do it once and do it right.