Swinger Bushing or Needle bearings

[oldsking86]

SO which do you guys use on your 250r? Needle bearings or Nylon bushings? I'm stuck on what to go with on this new swinger I acquired ;)

[super90]

Dosent it use both? On my 200x theres 4 needle bearings and 2 outer bushings?

[oldsking86]

well yea they do use both but I was referring to this idea

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Honda-250R-85-87-ATC-TRX-Swingarm-Bushings-WHITE_W0QQitemZ280187109196QQihZ018QQcategoryZ4397 2QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Just wonder if anybody had given it a shot before

[SWIGIN]

i dont like the idea of my swing arm flexing and moveing around... id go bearing

[cr480r]

I dont like the idea of not having a sleeve to tighten the bolt solid against.... I'd go bearing

[torker]

Well, Nylon doesn't move at all. Solid it is. And pretty easy to replace as well.
Will those last 10 or 20 years, I don't think so. But I have bought 2 pivot bolts and some other susp. bolts this month due to this. And all my machines get really hard use. I'm sticking with Nylon. Just my opinion.

TORKER.

[MyMistress86R]

The guy that makes those bushings is a member on the boards here...x.system. I bought my bike from him 2 years ago and he gave me a set of those bushings for it. Been running them since and they are still as good as the day I put them in. Makes swinger bolt removal stupid easy too. I give them a 110% approval rating and would put them in any bike I ever own without hesitation.

[SWIGIN]

iv never had a problem with swingarm bolt removale due to the fact that i LUBE every thing well and never had a problem.

any plastice or rubber bushing will deflect...... thats a fact

plus i thought you ran the tube that the swinger bolt goes into with these bushings. if not and your just smashing them into the frame....well thats just a bind i dont need.

[MyMistress86R]

It assembles just the same with the bushings. The way he designed them, they replace the needles inside and all 4 dust caps. Just pop one bushing into each hole in the swinger and presto, done. They don't quite touch together inside the swinger, but with the way they are designed they provide about an inch more support for the bolt from side to side since the equivalent space for the dust caps is part of the bushing.

[SWIGIN]

but when you use the bushings and tighten the swingarm bolt it has to bind... right?


like when you un bolt the shock does the swingarm fall or just stays there

[MyMistress86R]

On mine, it drops like a bad habit. Completely free and loose. Of course, it's not like I impact the nut onto the bolt. Just a good, secure tightening.

[oldsking86]

hmmm I think I may just have to use this idea for my new swing arm then. I have the needle bearings on my other and they work fine.. I just picked up an aluminum one off the 88/89 250r. If I remember correctly he does make them for that one too.

One thing I love, these aluminum swing arms are LIGHT!

[Tri-Z Pilot]

Yeah, I'm going with nylon. I dont see a prob, most of the bushing parts on performance suspensions/parts for cars these days are switching over to polyurethane and nylon. If they can take the abuse with all that added weight and torque, they should be more than enough for a bike.

[250rulzes]

"Any plastic or rubber bushing will deflect...... that’s a fact" Maybe, but x.systems are made of delrin. Needle Bearings were designed to reduce friction at a rotating surface, not a pivoting surface. That’s why bushings are superior in my opinion. X systems bushings are the best, I bought 5 sets, still have the first set installed, zero slop, and worry free.

[Rustytinhorn]

You cant go wrong going stock. Just lube everything up real good when you install it.

[Dirtcrasher]

There are some really great plastics out there that in certain applications are a great choice.

Like the guys were saying, unless that OEM or other sleeve is in between the 2 nylon bushings, then there HAS to be some binding because your pulling the frame rails into the swinger rails when you tighten the swinger bolt.

The bolt gets torqued to the spec and thats it, I can't imagine that tightening it till it binds and then backing it off a hair is a good idea.

If you have the money, I'd go OEM. But, I wouldn't hesitate to give the nylon bushings a try if they do use a spacer.

It's similar to your front wheel bearings or rear carrier bearings, without that sleeve between the bearings, they are going to bind when the axle is tightened between the 2 bearings and collars.

The only other problem with plastics is stiction. Needle bearings are super smooth and there is no friction in a radial movement. Suspension is meant to be smooth and thats why needle bearings are used not to mention the rigidity of the setup.

I would not use them without the collar between them.

[Mrs.Mosh]

"Any plastic or rubber bushing will deflect...... that’s a fact" Maybe, but x.systems are made of delrin. Needle Bearings were designed to reduce friction at a rotating surface, not a pivoting surface. That’s why bushings are superior in my opinion. X systems bushings are the best, I bought 5 sets, still have the first set installed, zero slop, and worry free.
I have to agree here. We Just threw some in Mosh's 250r,and mine is next.

[cr480r]

Running the swingarm bolt anything less than tight is just like loosening up a motor mount... Think about it... I dont see any problems with the delrin material, but until they come with an inner sleeve to allow proper tightening... I wont be buying them... Properly greased bearings have proved to work just fine...