what is up with this cam journal? 200X HEAD

[rally4x4racer]

I got two heads from this guy on ebay and they both have these holes or shapes in the smaller cam race - any idea what it is? I would guess it is still useable because there is a journal that holds that part of the cam - any one ever see this before? they are not consistent concerning location.

[rally4x4racer]

btw- thats a 200 head I think, the 200x head has the same conditions tho

[hrc200x]

It appears to be from someone putting the cam bearing on wrong, the bearing has a dowl sticking out if it that goes in the nicest looking hole, if thats not lined up when the head cap goes on whats shown in your pics happens, turns into swiss cheese.

[rally4x4racer]

your saying by bolting the head down with the cam bearing in the wrong position (ie - dowel not in hole) that this will happen? Thats what it looks like to me - but surely the surface is not that soft? and how much torque would that take? I dont have a cam bearing for the 200x handy - can anyone verify it has a hole in the dowel?

[NINJA]

Believe me, it doesn't take much to crush a dowel pin into a cam bearing journal, I've seen it more times than I can count. That aluminum is very soft compared to that hardened dowel pin. Notice the slight marks to the right also, that was prolly from just settin it in there.

[greenhuman]

The dowel is hollow which makes it easier to punch the hole in the alloy. Most times it crushes the steel sleeve a bit , then the cam end journal siezes or welds itself to the sleeve when it gets hot.

[Liquid-Darkness]

I would clean it up and resurface everything. Then have a local aluminum welder drill out the dowl hole and weld up the extra hole. You could use a small die grinder or electric grinder with little bits and polish the journal so its back to like new. The cam would wear the weld down after some miles if needed. Oh dude, yeah the surfaces of these heads are that soft. Darn my luck, I went to tourque down my cam sprocket bolts on a 350x and managed to bump my head surface with the wrench, got a little impression on the alloy and it leaked ever sense. :(

According to my 200x manual, there is a bushing that holds the other side of the cam shaft. It sits of the opposite side of the cam sprocket. The manual clearly states that there is the bushing, pin and one hole. The hole is located in the middle and the bottom. I am looking into the 200s manual. If someone already has it, could you thumb through to the head section and read how many bushing holes and pins there are?

[SWIGIN]

So you guys think this head was set up for a roller bearing cam? If I were going to use that head with a stock cam or non-roller cam, I would clean it up and resurface everything. Then have a local aluminum welder drill out the dowl hole and weld up both of them. You could use a small die grinder or electric grinder with little bits and polish the journal so its back to like new. The cam would wear the welds down after some miles if needed. Oh dude, yeah the surfaces of these heads are that soft. Darn my luck, I went to tourque down my cam sprocket bolts on a 350x and managed to bump my head surface with the wrench, got a little impression on the alloy and it leaked ever sense. :(


your a little off.... the stock cam has a removable bearing or bushing on that end of the cam, and it has a dowl that will sink right into the head if not lined up right.

just make sure no aluminum is sticking up higher then the original surface and it will be perfectly fine to run since the bearing is hardend

[Liquid-Darkness]

your a little off.... the stock cam has a removable bearing or bushing on that end of the cam, and it has a dowl that will sink right into the head if not lined up right.

just make sure no aluminum is sticking up higher then the original surface and it will be perfectly fine to run since the bearing is hardend

Check again, that was before I edited my post dude. ;)

[SWIGIN]

but there is no need to weld since the cam rides in a bearing/bushing and not on the head surface.

i ran motor like this for years with no problem what so ever

[Liquid-Darkness]

but there is no need to weld since the cam rides in a bearing/bushing and not on the head surface.

i ran motor like this for years with no problem what so ever

I guess thats true huh. I dunno, I always just try to keep parts like that as in-specs as possible. You are right though, it should be fine.

[rally4x4racer]

thanks for all the help, gentlemen. Thats what I was thinking - that it is still useable. Part of me wants to put a weld in there and grind it out :) but I think thats an OCD kicking in?

thats crazy these heads are so soft. and its unbelieveable someone put this thing together paying that little attention. - no wonder it got parted out.

would that affect the valvetrain if it was run like that? i notice the new dowel hole is not lined up center with the old one... so that means the whole cam assy is off center

[Liquid-Darkness]

thanks for all the help, gentlemen. Thats what I was thinking - that it is still useable. Part of me wants to put a weld in there and grind it out :) but I think thats an OCD kicking in?

thats crazy these heads are so soft. and its unbelieveable someone put this thing together paying that little attention. - no wonder it got parted out.

would that affect the valvetrain if it was run like that? i notice the new dowel hole is not lined up center with the old one... so that means the whole cam assy is off center

That might be that they never used the custom dowl hole. Maybe someone got borred and decided to booger it up. :wondering

[SWIGIN]

just make sure no aluminum is sticking up higher then the original surface and it will be perfectly fine to run since the bearing is hardend


you do know that the dowl goes in the hole dead center at the bottom right?.....lol

[rally4x4racer]

right swiggo - lol (notice my comment about assy earlier)

I have the head, valves, and cover with rockers. I guess what I am wondering is ****if they ran it like this, would there be any damage to the valve train?***

running a cam that was "off" like that could cause problems for other components - oh well I will just spec everything before I build - its probably fine


ANYONE WANT TO TELL ME HOW TO REMOVE THE SCREW THAT HOLDS THE ROCKER ARMS IN? THEY ARE ALWAYS STUCK!

[84honda200s]

hey homie, i dont think it would hurt the valves just the cam. try it homie but if it dont work let me know. i have 3 heads layn around. ill hook ya up cheap.

[SWIGIN]

right swiggo - lol (notice my comment about assy earlier)

I have the head, valves, and cover with rockers. I guess what I am wondering is ****if they ran it like this, would there be any damage to the valve train?***

running a cam that was "off" like that could cause problems for other components - oh well I will just spec everything before I build - its probably fine


ANYONE WANT TO TELL ME HOW TO REMOVE THE SCREW THAT HOLDS THE ROCKER ARMS IN? THEY ARE ALWAYS STUCK!



the biggest thing that would happen if it was run with the cam bushing off center would be the rockers would ware at a angle....but with a rebuild im sure you checked or replaced you rockers.....right?....lol


i would need to see a pic of the valve cover (bin to long since i seen a 200 apart) but with most hondas the rocker shafts just slide out

[greenhuman]

You can't run the cam off centre. Like I said before, the oil slipper bearing on the cam little end would squash and burn out the end of the cam plus the rocker box would not seal properly and leak all over the place.

[Liquid-Darkness]

ANYONE WANT TO TELL ME HOW TO REMOVE THE SCREW THAT HOLDS THE ROCKER ARMS IN? THEY ARE ALWAYS STUCK!

Just pop them out with a screw driver, or tap em out from one end. Press on the other end of the pin and then grab it with some plyers. Did you mean the dowls that hold on the rocker arm shafts?

[DIGGER DOG]

screw a 6 mm bolt into the rocker shaft and slightly tap it out
with a flathead and hammer or yamaha has a nice little slide hammer tool that is essentially a long 6 mm bolt with a weight on it.