Bout Ready to Give up on this Honda 200s, please help with Idel issue

[hoopduerr]

Hi All,

I dont know what the deal with this Honda 200s is, I bought and it in great condition but I cant get the thing to Idel.

Heres what it does:

Starts right up, you can drive around as long as your on the gas. Once you let it come back down, it idels out. Then wont start back up and harder to poll. You have to let it sit for about 10 mins, then will start right back up. (Sometime the plug fouls, its a darker caller.) Which I thought meant the fuel is rich but it seems like its not getting enough.


What I have done.
First Replaced Gas
Changed Oil
Check tank for any rust, tank inside looks great.
Put an inline fuel filter in, maybe jet were getting clogged.
Cleaned entire carb out, still did it.
Moved the throttle cable needle to every position. (Set back to default)
Replaced Air Filter
Tried to tweak idel and air screw. (Set back to default)
Took to Professional Shop they set the compression and everything, ideled when it left the shop. Next day would not idel.
Replaced Carb with brand new Carb (Still does it)
Took to my dads buddy, checked compression, he said he got it to idel. (brought back to house, wouldnt idel)

Do you think its the CDI? Should I buy a new Top End kit or somthing? (maybe the seals are bad and letting air in?)

Both are pretty cheap on ebay. ANY HELP WOULD BE AWESOME!

On half choke it seams to me like its ideling at the right RPM's. Not sure what the real problem is. I dont believe the carb is the problem. Everything is set back to default settings.

[atc4everbob]

Damn dude, if you replaced the carb with a brand new one, I think it's almost safe to say that's not the problem. Have you tried running it without the filter to see if it idles? Have you taken the petcock apart and cleaned the screen inside? If your plugs are still turning black and fouling with a new carb, it almost has to be something else. An air leak would probably make it run LEAN, not rich like you're describing. A good way to check for an air leak is to start it and get it to run at a consistent RPM (since it won't idle), spray starting fluid all over around the intake area. If the engine revs, you have air leak. Be sure to do this on a COLD engine, not hot. Also, double-check to insure the throttle slide was installed properly in the top of the carb and make sure it snaps all the way closed. You should hear a distinct pop when it bottoms out at no throttle. Do this, of course, without it running. First, try pulling the air filter off and running it, but be careful of dirt getting sucked into the carb.

[blue27]

try running with the gas cap off or half off, the vents in the cap can clog and vaccum the tank and stop fuel from flowing to the carb, after you sit for awhile it will start to work again. Try it its free!!! Another thing did you reuse the vent hoses from the old carb? Check to make sure they are not clogged.

Good Luck

[hoopduerr]

Thanks all, for your responses. I will try these this weekend when I get back to my house. If anybody has any more advice please let me know, going to pull out all the stops.

[thefox]

Do you have to clean the plug before restarting it or are you just letting it sit without doing anything?

[hoopduerr]

Just letting it sit and not doing anything usually does the trick. Like I said before at about half choke it seems to idel good. Which sounds to me like it not getting enough fuel.

[stoney420]

probably not your problem but make sure that inline filter is constantly staying filled with gas also and is not restricting the gas flow, also be sure you have it on there right, there should be a arrow on the plastic that points towards the back of the bike for direction of flow, i doubt this is your problem but i know in times like these any little bit of info can help and its probably something easy.. good luck

[insaneclowns]

u may also look at the the gas cap it could be cloged and it will cause it to run but after ridin it. it will get the tank varpor look and not let the the fuel flow. u can try ride it with the gas cap loose to see if it help and make sure it is on the on postion on top of the cap. these is just on more thing that it could be. but i would try to help u out


Eric

[hoopduerr]

Does it sound to you like its not getting enough flow?

[johnny's X]

I am with blue 27 on this one sounds like your cap is shutting of your air flow in the tank. letting it sit might be pushing air back through the carb and letting it run until it uses all of the air in tank.

[hoopduerr]

Hi Guys,

Tried some of your suggestions out with no luck.

I also just replaced the fuel line and took out the inline fuel filter.

I ran with the cap off to see if the vapor lock was seizing it up, but it still continued to die if my thumb wasnt on the gas a little.

For some reason it idels well for the most part on half choke, is there a setting in the thumb throttle to where I can move it up a little so it can constantly give it more gas without actually holding it down?

At least its running....

Thanks for all your help any more suggestions are surely appreciated!
- HoopD

[SYKO]

could be the fuel screen or petcock in the tank is partly clogged, take that all apart and clean/inspect

[blue27]

There is an idle adjustment screw on the carb, turn in to increase idle

[RedRider_AK]

Yeah the idle screw on the carb just raises the slide exactly like giving it gas does, just turn in the idle screw until it idles.

[Huffa]

It sounds to me like it may possibly be electrical, referring to your stator, # 4 in this pic below.

What happens is when a stator gets weak (bad connection in windings) you 1st have good spark and as it heats up the spark gets weak and the bike starts running richer of course and can run crappy then or not at all and then when you let it cool down it will fire right up again.

Make the problem reoccur so it won't start and check for a healthy spark but 1st check it in begining when the trike does run right so you know how the spark looks and if you have a weaker spark when problem occurs, then the stator is screwed up, maybe?

I'm no electrical expert but I've had this happen on two machines that I had years ago.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v253/huffa/1825_LEFTCRANKCASECOVERALTERNATOR.gif

[hoopduerr]

I have tried turning the old idel screw but that seams not to do it, help a little but doesnt solve the problem even fully turned for max idel.

Im going to try to cleaning the pet cock out, and then test out the spark like you indicated with the stator (Thanks for that, should be interesting to see what it does).

[RedRider_AK]

I think your pilot jet might be dirty. Have you cleaned it at all?

[threewheelin-feelin]

i agree with huffa on it being electrical...and the same problem as the stator will happen with the ignition coil

[topoortorideon4]

i would shake your hand if you could get my 200m to idol.Once it heats up thats it it wont idol.

[Huffa]

i agree with huffa on it being electrical...and the same problem as the stator will happen with the ignition coil

Oh yea, forgot about the coil, your right ! :beer

[hoopduerr]

Can I just replace the primary ignition coil? or should I replace the whole stator (or is the same thing)? Also does ignition coil store current, dont want to get shocked.

[Nightbiker07]

my 1980 xl80s has the same problem. wont idle on anything but full choke. im used to it by now, and i just deal with it.

you might try to rebuild the carb, new seals and whatever.........

[chevdanbarnett]

have the same thing with mine let me know if you figer it out i got the same modle would love to figer it out bought it for my sons birthday has not got to ride it yet bad dad let me know please if you figer these out thanks dan

[Huffa]

my 1980 xl80s has the same problem. wont idle on anything but full choke. im used to it by now, and i just deal with it.

you might try to rebuild the carb, new seals and whatever.........

naaah, don't just deal with a simple problem like that, yours is telling you "Hey Man, I'm not getting enough fuel!"...........just clean out the fuel screw adjustment screw orfice, it goes screw, spring washer, oring, dont' lose the washer or oring!!

Oring sometimes comes out, sometimes stays in and you have to use a small pic to get it out.

Do the above and clean out pilot jet and the petcock inline filter and bowl if you have one and problem should be solved.

1) fuel screw

2) pilot jet

2.5 ) make sure bowl is clean

3) petcock

4) inline filter & bowl (if it has either ) ........check fuel flow then

Since we are both doing each others favors lately :naughty: your welcome to send the carb to me to fix. Only cost a few bucks to send it but then again I think you certainly have the know how for that small project.

[3whlsrule]

Kind of a newb here but one thing I have not seen suggested it pilot screw adjustment. On the carb, where the bowl meets the body, toward the front of the carb. Its a brass knurled shaft with a slot for a slotted screwdriver (I use a hex driver bit). Turn it carefully clockwise JUST until it stops, no further counting the number of FULL turns and FRACTIONAL turns. It should be about 2 and a half turns. If not, then turn counter-clockwise to the 2 and a half turn point and try running the trike. If this does not do it, try turning the screw counter-clockwise another one half turn until you get an idle. You may have to mess with the idle screw itself after you make this adjustment (refer to earlier reply to this post). This procedure has worked for me in the past on problems of this nature.:p

[bigreddaddy]

You also might want to check your throttle cable. There are 2 adjustments, one at the thumb lever and the other at the top of the carb. Also check that the cable is routed correctly. One way to check is when you have it running, turn the front tire all the way left and right and see if you notice a difference in how it runs.
Have you ever checked compression?

[hoopduerr]

What Im pretty sure it not is, is the Carb. The carb is brand new because I was done dealing with the cleaning of it, cleaned my last carb three times. (And at no avail, must of not been the carb because bike is doing the same exact thing)

Just to keep you updated: I decided to buy a Primary Ignition Coil, (Is this the same thing as the "Ignition Coil?) from some other postings that I read. People said it could be the stator which are like 160 bucks and I dont have the funds for that. But I picked up a P.I.C. for 20 bucks and should be coming in the mail in the next 3 days or so.

I have a repair book which Im going to read up on, any other recommendation on installing the Ignition Coil?

Also Big Red Daddy where is that Thumb adjustment? My trike is about 30 miles away and I only really have to weekends to work on it. Compression was set by the honda dealer who had it running when I got it back but then after a day it stopped again.

Thanks for all your help, from the looks of it this looks to be a ongoing 200s problem for a lot of people.