E85 ethanol and 3 wheeler.

[WIkid500]

Ok guys I've been dreaming of this for a while, and just found out we have E85 in town now. Anyhow the ytm is in need of a rebuild. it's getting a hi-comp piston for sure, a cam, and whatever else is needed. I want to be able to run E85 because of it's high octane rating. I forget how high it is, and I need to know how much compression I can run with E85 fuel. Also what do I need to do you be able to run E85 through my carb. Is there an alcahol kit I can buy to convert it, or a new alcahol carb?


Thanks everyone!

[team-red-rider]

as far as i kno just needs bigger jets

[ATC-Eric]

I didnt know E85 was higher octane. Can you tell me a little more?

[vegas250rr]

octane level is between 100-105 according to this site
http://www.agriculture.state.ia.us/e85q&a.html

[BigReds Forever]

hum, i always heard that it was higher...like 110ish, but i dont know for sure.. id say you'd be safe with 12 to one. And as far as the carb, i think you can make it work by just jetting richer on all circuits. (especially the pilot as lean starting on ethanol is a pain). also, you might want to advance ignition timing a little if you can find a way to do that (offset flywheel key perhaps?)

[vegas250rr]

HMMMM, this is interesting


What is the range of a flexible fuel ethanol vehicle?
Ethanol has less energy content than gasoline. However, E85 also has a much higher octane (ranging from 100 to 105) than gasoline. FFVs are not optimized to E85, so they experience a 5% to 15% drop in fuel economy. This will vary based on temperature and driving conditions. For comparison purposes, aggressive driving habits can result in a 20% loss and low tire pressure can reduce mileage by 6%.

[200x350xtriz250]

not sure, but I think it creates a some type of acid that will eat untreated/uncoated engine parts. I looked into converting a car a while back. there is a kit that is sold to convert any car to e85. if I remember right it consisted of running a mixture through the engine - gas additive - for a certain amount of time. the additive coated all the parts with something that would prevent corosion. with cars there were also some other steps, but the car i was considering had fuel injection...with a carb it may only be the one step and rejet. if you do a search on the web for e85 conversion kit you should this info.
keep us posted on how this goes...I'm very interested in this.

[rustyhondas]

E85 is 85 % alcohal and 15% gasoline.

there is nothing corosive about the fuel,but the thing is alcohal atracts water,
so you should probably drain the fuel and the carb after you are done riding.
and maybe spray WD40 down the spark plug hole and through the carb and kick it over a few times before you store the bike,I don't know if this is what guys that run alcohal bikes do,but i would.

Like the same thing you do with nitro RC cars.you put after run oil in the engine.wich is basicly marvel mistery oil.

that water that the fuel atracts will rust the inside of the engine.

I think that running E85 is a great idea.

If i was doing it ,I would buy one of them FTZ alcohol carburetors.

one thing you should know is your fuel mileage will suck big time running E85 or 100% alcohal,you are going to be running some huge jets.

there are counter balacer covers that have a adjustable timing tab on them for the magnetic pickup on the flywheel.that is how you adjust the timing on a 250R engine. there nice because there billit, if you rebuild your own bottom ends you will know how fragile the stock one is ,cast aluminum one cracks so easy when you remove it.

You are going to make some good hourse power with E85,i would totaly do it if i could buy it at a pump in my town.

the thing that makes E85 bad for some cars is ,older cars have fuel lines that dont like alcohal,

[200x350xtriz250]

http://www.altfuels.org/backgrnd/altftype/e85.html
this link has some disadvantages of e85...it says "Ethanol is somewhat corrosive, though less so than methanol".

[200x350xtriz250]

http://www.iowacorn.org/ethanol/ethanol_3b.html
another says: "Early on, some elastomers (rubber-like parts) and metal in these fuel system components did deteriorate over time. Very quickly manufacturers changed these fuel system components to be compatible with ethanol fuel." 3 wheelers are not equipped with these "compatible components." it may not hurt, I don't know...just offering some input.

[Bigbore]

All of the o-rings that are in contact with the fuel must be made of viton. If their not, the alcohol will eat them up in a week or two. The fuel line needs to be replaced with line that can handle alcohol as well. I've got a book here with the % increase that you'll need to incrase the jet sizes. You need to change ALL of the jets, not just the main. An alcohol carb would be a good one to get, maybe a lectron. Mikuni makes one that alot of guys are running on karts and Jr. Dragsters. The engine size is close on the cc's and would be the best and easiest carb to get.

[WIkid500]

Wow thanks a bunch guys! All the info here is great. I think I'm going to end up finding an alki carb to put on there, and new fuel lines. With that done it should make jetting easy. I will have to find or have made a 2-4deg advanced timing key too. The rest of the engine work will be done at the same time mid summer.

[rustyhondas]

go down to page 14 on this PDF page,it is in the uper rite corner of the page. it is a timing adjuster for a 250r.

you don't use a offset key on a 250r you just move the magnetic pickup. the pickup is bolted to the counter balance cover,with the adjustable cover you can advance and retard the timing.

http://www.nacsracing.com/catalog/Nacs_V10.pdf

[WIkid500]

go down to page 14 on this PDF page,it is in the uper rite corner of the page. it is a timing adjuster for a 250r.

you don't use a offset key on a 250r you just move the magnetic pickup. the pickup is bolted to the counter balance cover,with the adjustable cover you can advance and retard the timing.

http://www.nacsracing.com/catalog/Nacs_V10.pdf



That would be sweet if I had a Honda. I'm going to run this experiment on my Yamaha ytm-200 I will have to find an advanced key to get the job done. I think I will be ok to try the test with out advancing ignition. I will have a hi-comp piston, and cam in it along with a carb set up for akli. If it all runs decent when I get the carb adjusted I then can mess with timing to see if there is a difference as i watch for detonation.


It might be a month or so before I get this all up and going, but I will keep you all posted. Thanks for the help. If anyone has other Ideas feel free to post em up. I'll take any advise I can get.

[rustyhondas]

My bad

I have 250r's on the brain.

I forget that there are other bikes out there