odd problem

[YTM200BOY]

I think i finally did detect something i donno i played with it for about 5 hours today. and i put new plug in new gas and check spark so far its all good... on next i tryed pulling it with my hand covering in back of the carb no go. Then i had another dumb i dea put a tiny sray of starting fluid in the back of the carb and pull it and as i pulled it about half way out of the pull starter i hit the gas lever and it backfired. i did it again and it basically started. well kind of it would sputter a bit after the rope was all gone.. but still does truly start . got any more ideas? besides the choke which i cant find i think ill wait it out and try in the summer when the choke isnt needed as much...:( -Joe

[WIkid500]

this is on the tri-moto right???

make sure the boot between the carb and the head isnt loose.
I had the hose clamp come loose on mine, the instant it sucked air it shut off. I pulled and pulled no start. after a while of looking what was wrong I slid the carb back in place and tightened all down and good to go.


you never had the cam out or tried to adjust it?

timing could be off...


have you had the carb apart?

you put a new plug in it?

[YTM200BOY]

theres a new plug new rewiring that gets great spark. Gas is there. The carb was rebuilt. "Still no choke" my airbox and the airbox hoses are off my bike. i am thinkin it IS the timing my dad's genuis buddy says it sounds like it is a timing issue and this guy is high up in the department but lives far away. The timing how do you adjust it i was told you cant?????

[YTM200BOY]

and this bike is the 83 ytm200ek

[Tri-ZNate]

Well have him check the timming and if it still wont start then get a choke for it.

[YTM200BOY]

its odd though because i used a coat hanger put it down into the pistion and brought it tdc and on the wheel it said T which i ges is good. but some times its in the middle of T and F so i donno

[thefox]

Why is the airbox off? That will make it suck in more air.

[WIkid500]

i dont know how to set the cam... I havent had mine apart or a manual for it... is the cam chain driven??? cause if its back firing through the carb, that would seem that the intake valve is open or opening during the compression stroke.

even with starting fluid it should run for a little bit, if its timed right

When we rebult my briggs motor for my lawnmower (the race motor)... we had the valve seats cut but forgot to grind that much off the valve stem and it did the same thing. backfired through the carb and wouldnt run...

you shure you had it on the right stroke??? and TDC i guess one tooth on the chain might make a big difference...

[DeePa]

id say hold it wide open throttle and pull the hell outta it and you may get something

[wheelie king]

Adjust your valves. Timing is Everything.

Did this to my 200s that always started hard, now it starts on first pull -every time.:Bounce

[YTM200BOY]

~UPDATE~ Well this morning i put the bitchin airbox on that was very diff to get on because of wires but i managed... now its on and i pulled it acomple times just to see if that would do anything lol sure well it didnt..:/ Then i tested to see if it was tdc and i noticed it said F F is bad or good i was told T is good?? i am starting to thing timing issue. then again this whole bike seems to be the issue. lol

[YTM200BOY]

deepa if i hold or tape the throttle wide open wont that blow something ?

[YTM200BOY]

i think in about 10 minutes im oing to go try again holding it wide open and yank the funk outta it or until my back snaps... another question on the fuel petcock. people with ytm200ek's where is the best place to turn the petcock to? up down left right ?

[Yamahauler]

do you have gas in your tank? you'll need that to start it.
turn the petcock to reserve if your not sure how much gas is in it

[YTM200BOY]

no i got gas im not that retarded it comes out forget the gas idea./

[Yamahauler]

Are you fuel lines good? not clogged?
Pull them off, and blow through them, dont assume they arent clogged...try it

[YTM200BOY]

i did and yes its fine when i put the petcock on it will get good amount of gas into the tube all the way into carb because i took the hose off when it was on and yep gas is there forget the gas idea... i spits some gas outta the back of the carb some times even.

[YTM200BOY]

lol yeah i forgot i also put new lines on this hole bike so they cant be clogged...


ok im going to go pull wide open lol watch with my luck i will blow the needles out or something..... maybe the bike will ingulf in flames and a demon will come out and say to me hahaha you should have bought into the honda family lol... Thanks again guys for input..-Joe

[slothminx]

Hold on a minit..... have you been trying to start the trike the whole time with no throttle at all?

[Yamahauler]

are the floats in the carb upside down? I did that once and the gas doesnt go into the bowl.
turn the drain screw on the carb, if gas comes out of the overflow hose, you know you have gas in your carb.

[q_r86250]

i actually have a manual somewhere for a ytm 200 and 225 so if i can find it i'll scan a few pics of the timing gear and the cam

so i ll try to dig it out ok

[YTM200BOY]

yes i got gasi just checked and i have tryed many times pullin with the throttle open no go... i think this bike is shoot....... if i get it running this summer i am selling it after i have good times with it and saving for a chevy nova i have always wanted.... 69-72 or 77-78 nova... you may hate em but i like em..-Joe

[YTM200BOY]

a running bike like this can get about 450 ay?? considering its all new wiring gas system "besides carb" new hoses new fender new handlebars and cables grab bar etc... good tires with about 75% thread left.

[YTM200BOY]

o yeah and i recently bought a new seat... that acutally fits properly into the groove.

[WIkid500]

50 bucks for it as is. I will arange pick up??? sound good???

and 78 novas kick ass!

[YTM200BOY]

lol screw you pal. lmao 50 lol i could scrap it for parts and make x10 on ebay shipping alone is a decent amont of money.

[YTM200BOY]

dont worry when i get it running then if you wanna buy it well talk....

[wheelie king]

I am telling you, man. :rolleyes: Adjust the valves and make sure it's timed correctly. That will most likely fix your problem. Do that, then post.

[traxxasx]

look ytmboy. its been told 4.829082109382190483295r7435r7439r709483209480 times to fix your timing back fire mean you timing is off, im telling you this one thing by putting gas in it and pulling it and do all this stuff will never get it to run, it cant run if the timing is off. It seems like your 12. just sell it as is since you dont wanna take anybodys advice to try to fix it. take it to a shop one day, get someone that is MECHANICALY INCLINED to fix it. sheeesh. lol 15 threads on same trike.

[YTM200BOY]

GOOD UPDATE!! finally i got my dad into this crap... Well he said and promised me we will both rebuild and correct the timing when it warms up.. so finally no more *Edited**Edited**Edited**Edited* loads of threads lol sorry again..... your NON mechaniclly inclined buddy.-Joe

but just for more info how do you take apart the engine without screwing stuff up like to being able to adjust the valves and stuff. Isnt it true *Edited* need speical compression and decompression tools to build a engine?? or can you just use commmon screwdrivers allenkeys hammers and nuts?

[WIkid500]

ahhh Joe you shouldnt need to tear the engine apart to set the timing! it all should be under the cam cover, in the cylinder head. GET A MANUAL!!!!!!! that will explain everything you need to do to set the timing of the valves!

[Yamahauler]

Why would you rebuild your motor if theres nothing wrong with it?
If you think you have enough money to rebuild it, use that money to take it into a shop.
Does your manual not have pictures? It is easy to follow a manual. Its been explained to you before how to adjust your timing, we cant adjust your timing for you...what dont you understand?

[YTM200BOY]

ok let me get this the cam cover is the plate on the left side of the engine that is held on by 2 screws on each side that shows the chain and the sporket?? i know how to take it off but when i look at it im stumped lol and im afriad to take it apart because i fear i screw something up and will never be able to ride lol.... so how do you adjust it ??? whe n you turn the bolt in the center of the gear it only turns it it doesnt tighten or loosen the bolt in the center!! ?? !! ??

[YTM200BOY]

my manual is crap it only shows pics of the rear end and the front engine the engine page i dont have lol!!

[Tri-ZNate]

isnt there a screw driver fitting in the center of the bolt?

[YTM200BOY]

lol sorry the above post was to have said: my maual is crap it only shows pics of everything but the engine because the guy i bought it from didnt have the engine pages. so basically i can do anything by readding my manual except the engine stuff lol..... now you get why i dont have a clue what your talkin about??

[YTM200BOY]

no there is no screwdriver fitting in the center of my bolt... are you on the same bike mine is a ytm200ek from 83

[Tri-ZNate]

I was thinking of adjusting valves, forgot you have issues with timing.

[YTM200BOY]

damn 250sxwheeliepop nice bike man that bike will look awsome when done!

[Yamahauler]

Buy a clymer manual, they are the easiest to understand. you have to hold the pull starter hub with something to get the cam bolt off(wrench wedged between it and the footpeg is what i use.)
Now go and try this: On the carb, there is a little screw at the bottom of the float bowl (right beside the overflow hose) loosen it and tell me if gas pours out of the hose.
Start with the easy stuff first.

[YTM200BOY]

yes gas system is fine guarenteed carb is so clean you can eat outta it and there are new seats and needles so carb and gas system isnt the prob.... Ok i understand the wedging idea. when i lossen the bolt then what so i do??

[YTM200BOY]

o wait i think it clicked in my brain!! i lossen it then match the T in the timing window with the slash on the gear to match the bump on the engine casing?? the nits aligned right????

[Yamahauler]

Go loosen that screw and see if gas comes out, its not hard to put the float in upside down, it fits both ways easily.
Dont post again til you try it. Your carb could be brand new but if youinstalled the float upside down, no gas will be getting in the carb

[YTM200BOY]

no i know for a fact it gets gas because i recently took the carb off and there was gas in the bowl so no the gas isnt the prob for the 10th time...

[Unclediezel]

Ok-Joe----
There are 2 kinds of timing--Ignition and Camshaft-(VALVE)--
If you have the cam cover off----Line up the bump on the case with the mark on the gear---and look in the hole for the timing---IT SHOULD SAY "T"

If it doesnt- you will need to go further inside the bottom half to find out why the rotor moved-----Then if still havent found the problem you will need to find out why the cam gear moved----These are all "PRECISION" located parts which MUST be in their designated locations to function properly.--"HINT"---if it backfires in the carb--a spark is occurring with an open intake valve---backfire in exhaust---spark at an open exhaust valve---etc--

[YTM200BOY]

ok thank you unclediezel i did that and its a perfect T!!! i so happy its not the timing well that settles the timing problem.. thank you very very much i figured that out in about 10 minutes. well gas problem cant be because gas is in bottom of carb just fine... needle valve and seat are brand new so i dont think that could be the problem "carb". i hope to take power mechaincs class when im a junior cant wait.. then autos in senior.. yes! lol well about hte ytm200 ek edition lol yes spark was tested everytime i play with the bike its always a good constant blue spark. so its not timing not gas not electic lol what else is there???? the guy that rewired my bike told me my carb was basicallly shot. he said this because the prevouis tard that owned it crimped the drain pipe because od leakage could this be the problem no air in carb?? i donno just a guess... well thanks now i know its not timming related :} this made my day hahaha....thanks again Joe

[Yamahauler]

Check your compression, put your finger over the spark plug hole, if it doesnt push it off...theres your problem.
If you want to do it right you would get a compression tester to check the PSI of compression. It is very simple to use, screw the end in the spark plug hole, and pull the rope a few times.
But try it with your finger first, if it doesnt push your finger off the hole, there is something seriously wrong.

[YTM200BOY]

can i pick up a tester at like a local wal-mart or target>??? and how much are they i have the manual page for psi

[Yamahauler]

pick one up at Harbor Freight or something, they should have one for dirt cheap.

While you at it, pick up a COMPLETE manual with the engine pages.

[WIkid500]

do you have a auto parts store around??? should be 25ish. you dont need anything that good. just to get a reading.

glad you figured out its not timing. to bad you wernt closer I would put my carb on and give it a try for yea.

so what have you done to the carb?? new needle and seat??

[YTM200BOY]

lol thanks for the thought about the carb WiKid. Well i see the compression test with the finger in the hole.. It doesnt blow my finger off but it gives a puff of air up. Is this ok?? Also i got a question. Ok say we got a hole complete bike "ytm200ek" lets say your siting on it. The right side there is a cover on the engine on the complete other side where the pull starter is on the left side. Its the cover that says yamaha.. I donno what this is. I cant seem to unscrew the 3 screwws!! I put a screw driver to see if i could pop it open and tons and tons of this orange sand or dirt went all over the floor it was complete madness. lol behind this cover plate is there just the pull start components?? thanks again for the thought Wikid

-Joe

[YTM200BOY]

and yes what i did to the carb is put a new needle and seat on it. The old neddle was completely shot. Now i got a great carb inside.. Still no choke though.... i noticed today when i put my hand behind the back of the carb when it would suck and blow out air gas would go all over my hand what does this mean?? thanks -Joe

[Yamahauler]

behind that cover is nothing. Its just a cover for nothing.
If it doesnt blow your finger off the hole, im going to say you put a hole in your piston which is not good at all.

[YTM200BOY]

i wouldn't doubt that yamahauler ok thank you how do i see the piston?? and take it out?? can i leave the engine still on the frame......

[Yamahauler]

You know, I dont think thats a good idea....

[YTM200BOY]

o great mor e money into this bike lol.... is it easy to install and take out the old 1??? First i would like to even see if there is anything wrong with the 1 inside... How do i access the piston?

[YTM200BOY]

whats a not a good idea???

[Yamahauler]

OK...its going to cost over $300 in parts.
I dont think you'll be able to figure it out and I think you'll end up wasting $300 worth of parts
If I lived near you, I would rebuild it for the cost of parts.

[YTM200BOY]

300 bucks!!!!! Holy %@#@ no way it costs less then 50!!

[YTM200BOY]

thats more then i bought it for and then got the electrical all redone!

[WIkid500]

start with a brite light and shine in the plug hole to get a look at the top of the piston.

probably wont see much though.



I guess I would start with a manual. then take the head off. that means cam out, head off. then you would be able to see the top of the piston, and the cylinder wall on the down stroke. if there is a hole in the top of the piston you will need a new one. if the cylinder is all scored to hell (up and down lines, groves.) you will need to have the cylinder bored out with a new piston and rings. now if you take your time, this shouldnt cost too much. but dont go ripping and tearing, loosing parts along the way, yikes.

don't give up now you are almost there.

oh take pic's along the way, so you know how to reassemble.

[Yamahauler]

new piston -> $60 CDN
rings -> $30US (Buy mine!)
wrist pin -> $17CDN
clips -> $3each (I got jewed on that)
bore(maybe) -> $50
gaskets -> approx $50
Also you need to do valves

If you can get a wiseco kit, it might be cheaper.
It takes a bit of skill to do this.

actually, my rebuild cost $300 because I needed a new cylinder head.

[YTM200BOY]

I am so tired of this problems everytime i do something to get it 1 step further i go back 5 steps...... In the out come this bike will most likely never run again because ill tear it down or the bike will seat in a corner until i put it on the curb and put free on it..... i hate this feeling i thought i was just ready to ride when i got the needle and seat because thats all it needed now it might have all these problems...... omfg

[YTM200BOY]

lets say i tore apart the whole top of my engine and installed what ever is needed 2 b replaced. Then i get all the parts can it be done in a day?

[YTM200BOY]

copy n paste this plz tell me if this is the kit??? http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/YFM200-YTM200-Tri-Moto-4-New-OEM-Piston-Yamahauler_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ43977QQitemZ 4595864743QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD1V

[Yamahauler]

that is the second over size piston, you dont want that...you might not even need a bore...you have to tear it apart to find out.
If you do need a bore, only got to the next O/S (.010 over for wiseco, .020 for OEM piston)
My first rebuild took me four monthes because I couldnt find parts, I needed a cyl head, then I kept finding stuff that was broken and it took forever to find parts, but when i got all the parts, it took a day to put together.

my second one, I started putting it together at 4PM, and I was done at 2 am with a one hour break.
I just take my time and make sure I do it all right.

[IrvSLedman]

holy cow kid..ship it to me, ill fix it for free.

[nimda78]

yes i got gasi just checked and i have tryed many times pullin with the throttle open no go... i think this bike is shoot....... if i get it running this summer i am selling it after i have good times with it and saving for a chevy nova i have always wanted.... 69-72 or 77-78 nova... you may hate em but i like em..-Joe


thats funny, Nova means "wont go" ... save your time and call the yamaha Nova..it fits. lollololol

[Rm250RF900R]

Take it to a mechanic and be done with it. I wouldn't take the top end apart if you dont know what your doing/ tools to do it.

[YTM200BOY]

well my dad says its not the piston after i showed him all these posts lol this bike will never run....

[YTM200BOY]

is it worth it if this is the problem??? I put about 270 into it already if i bought a pistion kit and installed it will some professional help and got it running. could this bike be sold for more then what i put into it?

[Rm250RF900R]

I dont know. Post a picture of it.

[YTM200BOY]

ill get some shots today

[Lomax]

Damn I wish you were closer, I have a guy here that could have you riding in prolly 20 minutes if you dont need a rebuild. Thats no joke either, He pulls out parts bikes I have that are total junk IMO and fiddles with them, "intergrates" parts from other machines, slaps on some tires and takes off.

[Lomax]

DONT BUY A CRAPPY YAMAHA. THERE JUST MONEY PITS WITH NO RIDING ENVOLVED.....
--JOE

I wouldnt say that, Yamaha's are my first choice in most situations, If you want to make that statment true, pick up a KLT 110 :lol:

[Tri-ZNate]

I dont think you will have to much trouble YTM. Follow your manual and you cant screw up.

About $90 for the pistion kit is what it normally costs. If your lucky, and its not scored bad, you might be able to get away with a hone job. Or there might not even be any scoring.

[Yamahauler]

well my dad says its not the piston after i showed him all these posts lol this bike will never run....
How does he figure this? You have no compression.
You say you have spark, gas, and its in time....whats missing there???
YOU NEED COMPRESSION. your piston creates compression. If there is a hole in the piston, that would explain everything.
I wouldnt reccomend you rebuild the top end unless your absolutly positive how it works, and your confident how to do it. Its not like you can just pull the head and cyl, throw a new piston in, bolt it back on and your done...You need new gaskets, rings, hone (maybe bore), valve seals, maybe a cam chain., and most importantly, A clymer manual...You wouldnt be able to do it without.

[dufrain]

Go to Autozone and tell them you want to rent a compression tester,I will be like 25 bucks,but when you return the thing they will give all your money back.Post what the guage says ,there are directions in the box with the tester.
If the plug is dry,you have spark and compression and the timing right, you should be able to shoot one 1/4 second shot of starting fluid in the carb with the throttle held open and the thing should at least try to start with a crank or two.A tiny spray is all you need,NO more.

Get a clymer manual and compression tester before you do one more thing.

Adjust the valves with the directions in the clymer manual,if you have messed with the adjustment you may have the valves staying open ,that would cause no compression.

[Tri-ZNate]

Know what? I'll bet you have a stuck open exhaust valve :lol:. That would explain alot. Just put your hand over the exhaust and pull the recoil. If you have constant exhaust comming out you have your problem.

[YTM200BOY]

exhaust valve tell me more plz how do i check if its stuck?? i am getting alot of air blow out of the spark plug hole and the hole here the airbox hose on the engine goes.. so exhaust valve how do i check?? this seems to be more like the problem

[YTM200BOY]

ill go down im my garage and pull it with my hand over the exhaust pipe ill let you know in a minute wat happens.

[YTM200BOY]

well it blows air out isnt that what is suppost to happen?? is this the problem?? i donno what *Edited**Edited* talkin about

[YTM200BOY]

maybe it exhaust valve because i smelled it and it smells funky? its wierd this may be it i donno anymore lol.. tell me how to check is it easy??

[Tri-ZNate]

You know what the exhaust valve is right? It one of two valves that opens on the 4th stroke to let exhaust out of the engine. If the valve is stuck open (and with you spark plug screwed on) you will get constant exhaust out of the exhaust. If it isnt your problem you will only get a puff every 4th stroke.


1st stroke- Exhaust valve closes, Pistion goes down, intake valve opens, gas and air come in
2nd stroke- Pistion comes up, intake valve closes, combustion occurs
3rd stroke - Pistion comes down
4th sroke- Pistion comes up, exhaust valve opens, exhaust exits cyclinder.

[YTM200BOY]

so its screwed up only if it blows out air like when you blow air out wiht your mouth?

[YTM200BOY]

well it puffs air out thats correct then ay?

[Tri-ZNate]

yeah if it only puff air out then you should be ok. If you get a compression tester it will help to figure out whats wrong.

[WIkid500]

hey I had a thought....

what if its a valve thats burnt out of it. or a piece of a valve is busted. then it would have no compression also.

tear the head off. it might be something a new valve and seat grind will fix.

[YTM200BOY]

Do i have to take the engine out of the frame. I really dont wanna do that. The 4 bolts on the top of the engine need to come off to access the inside?? i donno which way is correct to peck inside the engine.

[Yamahauler]

PLease, get a clymer manual....You will not figure it out any other way.

You say you have a manual...but its missing the pages you need! Its useless!

[YTM200BOY]

lol about that i found the correct pages i got the whole manual now but it tells me the oppisite order of what to do. The page was under my drum stick bins lol who would have thought?

[Yamahauler]

If its in the opposite order, take it to a librarian, they can read the page numbers and put it in the correct order.

[YTM200BOY]

lmao nvm you dont get what i ment

[Yamahauler]

Look...If you dont understand that manual, get a clymer.
Shop manuals are made for mechanics, so it doesnt explain all the little things like which way to turn a bolt to loosen it.
Clymers are made for average people with little mechanical skill, they explain things more thorough and give you little tips on how to take hard things apart.

[Russell 350X]

Get a freakin Clymer manual, it will solve all of your problems.!!!!


Damn....!!!!


Russ