250r clutch question???

[freaksfix]

Its a 83 250r,,, and when running in netural with the clutch out the motor is under a load and wants to stall, but with the clutch in its fine???? Any info would be great!!! Freaks

[jeswinehart]

I have thought and thought about this and still ain't come up with any kind of decent advice ,, I would just be guessing.
Best I can offer is to copy from my manual the pages dealing with the clutch and mail them to you.
Let me know freaks ,,, john

[Unclediezel]

Two real stupid shots --Did you change oil recently, and if so-did you use a heavier oil. For some stupid reason -oil viscosity can "Drag on internal engine and trans parts- #2- Bent shifter fork- Does it move at all before it stalls? Is it actually getting into Neutral?if the fork is bent it may not fully disengage the "ShiftShaft"and actually hold the bike in gear.

[sandrooster]

Have you done a compression check?
Sounds like you might need a new the top end if the compression is low.

[slothminx]

Have you done a compression check?
Sounds like you might need a new the top end if the compression is low.


Im not sure if you posted this in the wrong thread but, his clutch is dragging not his engine being hard to start low on power etc.;)

Will

[freaksfix]

Well good news the drag went away after 10min of run time... It must of been dry from sitting for a year after the new crank, crank seals & bearings, and topend.... Grass drags here we come!!!!

[TeamGeek6]

Just be prepared to lose a transmission bearing shortly, its probably damaged a bearing if its had that much drag.:eek:
Not only can it ruin the dry bearing, but the metal shavings can wander around the engine and ruin other things.

[freaksfix]

Just be prepared to lose a transmission bearing shortly, its probably damaged a bearing if its had that much drag.:eek:
Not only can it ruin the dry bearing, but the metal shavings can wander around the engine and ruin other things.


How would it ruin anything but the clutch plates from the clutch draging (not slipping) for 10min.. I dont see the logic in that.... I also dont see where any metal shavings would come from???

Please exlpain this for me???

[freaksfix]

I have thought and thought about this and still ain't come up with any kind of decent advice ,, I would just be guessing.
Best I can offer is to copy from my manual the pages dealing with the clutch and mail them to you.
Let me know freaks ,,, john



Thanks for the offer buddy,,, but im all set....

[TeamGeek6]

How would it ruin anything but the clutch plates from the clutch draging (not slipping) for 10min.. I dont see the logic in that.... I also dont see where any metal shavings would come from???

Please exlpain this for me???

The following is based on an 86R, should be pretty much the same design.

The clutch is not dragging. The clutch is working if you can notice a difference with the lever pulled in, or let out. The clutch plates will engage and turn the main shaft out of gear regardless of whether the clutch lever is pulled or not.

There are 3 main parts in that transmission:

1.) clutch
2.) main shaft w/gears
3.) output shaft w/ more gears

The condition of "let the clutch out in neutral and the engine dies"

proves that whatever is dragging is after the clutch, but before the output shaft. If it were before the clutch, the engine would drag all the time. If it were in the output shaft, it would only drag when shifted in gear.

(PS I boo booed when I wrote about the needle bearings, I think those are on the outer basket which turns all the time)

Anyway, if the trans is in neutral, the gears are not engaged and no power is sent through them, so they cannot cause drag. That leaves the main shaft bearings, and a dry bearing will drag very badly because the balls in the bearing will rub very hard against the bearing races and damage them instantly. The contact patch between balls and race is very, very ! small and that puts a lot of force on the races. There might only be 10 pounds of force (just a crude example) but imagine that 10 pounds on a needle point - thats sort of what the bearing sees inside.

Once a bearing race is damaged, it can only get worse. Those bearings are something like $ 3.00 - $6.00 each and can be bought at any bearing supply shop.

Those bearings are not sealed, so any damage that causes metal (steel) to come off allows that debris to circulate through the engine. There is no oil filter in that engine.

Its probably the left side main shaft bearing because that one is farthest from the oil supply. The oil supply goes into the transmission through a small hole in the lower right engine case, so it takes time to reach that far left side.

In this picture: gl1200harness.tripod.com/250pics/transncrankrside.gif

(copy and paste the URL in another browser window, Tripod wont let us click on it.)

shaft "2" is the main shaft and has a NSK6203 bearing on each end if memory serves. The clutch sits on the top (in the picture) end of shaft 2.

Heres the bearing that was probably causing the drag:
http://gl1200harness.tripod.com/250pics/insidelcase.gif

of course they put that one in and built the rest of the engine around it...:eek:

[freaksfix]

I checked all bearings when I had the cases spit for the new crank and what not.... And when I say the clutch "was dry" it dont mean the motor sat with no oil for a year,,, the top half of the clutch pac dont get oiled unless its spinning......


So why would the bearing drag for 10min if that and then stop and it not make any lowwer end noise???


Dont get me wrong im not saying your wrong but it just dont make sence??

[TeamGeek6]

One second without lube can damage a bearing in instantly and it may not be from being totally dry, even a lack of oil can do it. Once a little nick is developed in the bearing race, it will scream and raise cain till that nick breaks off. Then there is a gouge left that is free to start destroying the balls.

Its not about making sense, fact is, it did happen and from your description, it cannot be anything but one of those two bearings, because nothing else is working but them with clutch out and in neutral.