Atc 4 Me

[Darius1502]

Hey CoeShow,

Seems you haven't been on in a while but I have a request.

Could you describe (in as much detail as humanly possible) how your 85-86 250R's were setup for Baja style racing?

Gearing?
Suspension?
Motor work?
Pipe?
Type of air filter?
Seat?
Electronics/ignition?
Tires?

How was the powerband in those trikes? Were they setup for an emphasis on bottom end power or were the top end screamers or what? Any idea what their top speed was in full race trim?

Anything at all you can think of. The next 250R I get my hands on is getting the desert racing treatment. ;)

Recognize these machines by any chance? (http://www.3wheelerworldforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2404&d=1094955468) These are the only two images of Baja trikes I've been able to find on the net.

Dammit,

I love this idea! Nice going! Go for it!

Mike, you are a legend and reading about you kept me dreaming as a kid. You are a part of all us here and thats something very special.

For the guys growing up in the 80's....we will never forget you!

[CoeShow]

Hey guys,

I haven't been on for a while, but I will try to answer some of your questions.

Billy Golightly,

The very first M/C conversion I ever saw that I would actually ride was one built from a CR500. Prior to that I saw lots of scary half assed stuff!

Ace Williams installed a Speedway 500cc alky burner into a custom 3 wheel chassis of his own design that was way cool for the time. It was a rocket when it was running!

Dammit!,

You may feel I'm just being lazy on my reply here, but actually the best trike ever
was the one that was COMPLETELY STOCK except for an Ohlins shock, thicker "WAX-ON" seat, a CR250 silencer and of course a CR style throttle. I swear this is true!

Darius 1502

Please see above

[Dammit!]

I never thought of running a CR silencer. What year CR did you use and did it bolt right up or did it have to be modded to fit?

I remember hearing the Baja racers were nearly stock. Just never really believed it. Mine will probably be tricked out a little more just because I can't help myself. :lol:

Do you remember if the gearing was left stock or changed to compensate for the taller rear tires?

Really I'm looking for even the smallest details (if there are any).

[Billy Golightly]

Mike I know you've mentioned in the past that you didn't particularly care for short track racing...but I'm just getting into it down here with my 85R racing against TRX250Rs, 450Rs, YFZs, Banshees, LTR450s, etc. Probably a lost cause on my end, but do you have any tips on setup or the riding? Heres some pictures and a couple videos of me almost getting lapped, lol: http://3wheelerworldforums.com/showthread.php?t=57766&page=2 Did you guys normaly run the axles offset with the inside further in? Stock or shorter swingarms? Any info would be appreciated...

[firefirefire90]

Hey Mike...I remember talking to you and discussing how your bro still has one of your old trikes? If I could find a place to go around a track, would you gear up and ride? Just puttin it out there. Cheers.

[maggiesboy]

Wow! What a great thread! I just sat and read the entire thing (it took a few cups of coffee).

Mike, you are an asset to this site. Thank you for sharing your stories. It is great to know the "insider version"

[oldskool83]

man the odds or talking to a pro on the web got to me like 1 in 3000 billion!

[87250es]

here is a pic of the Pro

[team-red-rider]

remember this?

[cr480r]

I wanna hear about the atc480r...

[SYKO]

hey Mike, I love reading your history, as you may already know Billy is getting into flat tracking down here in florida, well Im getting into it as well, In fact Im picking up a 83 air cooled to race, Many have told me to race my 85 but I refuse, it took me many years to get one and I dont want to race it thats all. Any way, my question is what kind of mods were doen for the flat track air cooled models (83-84)? its no prob to set up a 85-86 but there isnt very much info on the air cooled models. I was hoping from some input from you on this mater, any help is greatly appreciated!!

[djw]

Mike,

A great thread.

You mentioned Wax a few times, and we use to to ride with him down at 24th ST.
A great guy, and sounds like he's doing fine.

He was quick with a tip or two for us newbies at the time. Even got to race him...

Well, can we say spanked.
I came in second on a two man race, so I got that working for me.:lol:

djw

[mnnmaz]

Does he still have any bikes!!!!???

[ATC-Eric]

here is a pic of the Pro


That pic is just awesome!!!!! :w00t:




Does he still have any bikes!!!!???

Who Mike? No trikes in his garage.

[Bryan Raffa]

hey mike plenty of time to plan...ha ha
Trikefest2007 will be June 21-24th, 2007 at Haspin Acres in Laruel, Indiana. Some of us get there a few days early to have extra fun. lol

Im positive there will be a extra bike for you to ride!!!

[Curtis-Tecate3]

Hey Mike,

Check out Dean Kirstens "Long Live 3Wheeling magazine" thread near the top of the page...
We have just had the pleasure to receive a post from Brett Driscoll..!

It is great to have you guys posting here from time to time.

Curtis

[driscoll333]

this is brett... hey COE do you still own the YAMAHA jersey from the baja 1000? hahaha . COE you can tell everyone the story. hahah. do you still live in san diego? talk to soon

[Tecate250]

Was there some sort of bet or something?
I like the sounds of a yam jersy on a honda rider.

[driscoll333]

coe did ride a yamaha once. i think it was 1988 at the baja 1000. sundahl ,coe and me teamed on a yamaha banshee. I was so pumped. here i was teamed with the 2 fasted riders in the world. should have been a cake walk. the race went like this... sundahl wadded the bike at mile marker 7. i was told it was the worst wreck that they had ever seen. but sunahl jumped back on the destroyed bike. (bent axle, broken frame, broke off gas tank, plastics everywhere,flat tire,etc...)and 993 miles to go. Coe gets on at mile marker 300 or so. Coe never wrecks and guess what? i was told he had flown off the track and was suffering from a concusion. yamaha had another guy get the bike to me and i got on at mile 600 or so. I rode for a conservitive finish. the bike looked like it had been dropped out of a plane. at dinner that night we all went to dinner in La Paz, MX. Coe was wearing a yamaha jersey and he couldnt figure out why. his head injury was still effecting him. Coe kept saying "I ride for honda, why am I wearing this yamaha jersey?" Hey mike do you remember? let me know if thats the way the story went.... brett

[TimSr]

coe did ride a yamaha once. i think it was 1988 at the baja 1000. sundahl ,coe and me teamed on a yamaha banshee. I was so pumped. here i was teamed with the 2 fasted riders in the world. should have been a cake walk. the race went like this... sundahl wadded the bike at mile marker 7. i was told it was the worst wreck that they had ever seen. but sunahl jumped back on the destroyed bike. (bent axle, broken frame, broke off gas tank, plastics everywhere,flat tire,etc...)and 993 miles to go. Coe gets on at mile marker 300 or so. Coe never wrecks and guess what? i was told he had flown off the track and was suffering from a concusion. yamaha had another guy get the bike to me and i got on at mile 600 or so. I rode for a conservitive finish. the bike looked like it had been dropped out of a plane. at dinner that night we all went to dinner in La Paz, MX. Coe was wearing a yamaha jersey and he couldnt figure out why. his head injury was still effecting him. Coe kept saying "I ride for honda, why am I wearing this yamaha jersey?" Hey mike do you remember? let me know if thats the way the story went.... brett

:lol: :lol: :lol: That is hilarious! Funny, he never mentioned that story on here!

[BigGreenMachine]

Thats hilarious!!! Great read, good to see another racer on here. Welcome Driscoll.

[Dammit!]

:lol: :lol: :lol: That is hilarious! Funny, he never mentioned that story on here!

Sounds like he may not remember it! :lol:

[87250es]

lol... dont worry mike, i would not tell any one i was on a yamaha either...

ok yammy guys i am just kidding. :)

[DixiePlowboy]

How unbelievably cool is this!

I'm off the board for a little spell, and come back to find factory racers(heroes of my childhood) and someone that headed up one of the magazines I spent most of my young life reading.


-Plow

[firefirefire90]

Hey Mike!


Guess who I just talked two? Your brother! Sam-the-Mustashe-man he is! What a cool dude! Now i'm on the lookout for a Bills pipe..:naughty: I met him over at Alba in the Dyno room. He was testing out a SWEET rhino!

In the 5 minutes I spent talking to him, I learned an essay's worth of information. Can't wait to let him see what i've been coming up with!

Chat back bro.

Nick

[Hondamatt250]

Hello Mike,
Glad your on board here. I have read a lot of magazines as a younger kid but never saw and video of ATC racing. Do you know where one can view some racing action from back in your day.
Take care -Matt

[Hondamatt250]

Hello Mike,
Glad your on board and good to have tha chance to ask some questions. First - is there a way to get some old video of racing back in the day? I would love to watch some footage. Do you know a source ?
Check this out -my first ATC experience, convinced my dad to let me use my lawn mowing money to buy the neighbor kids (he had every toy) 1982 250R. After coming off my YZ 60 the 250R was absolutely awesome. I'm 36 now and can't let go of my fever for ATC's.

[oldfart]

I now recall having dinner after that Baja 1000, with Coe, Sundahl and Driscoll somewhere in Cabo San Lucas. Coe was so out of it....... He didn't know what planet he was from.

[stefan34]

cool man a racer on board
I have a question can you make sence of the racing team that's printed on the back fender of my trike:

pic:
http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/9246/dsc03202xz6.th.jpg (http://img411.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dsc03202xz6.jpg)

[driscoll333]

my name is brett driscoll, i notice your from holland... i raced a yamaha at schkaveningen and rotterdam in 1985-86. i raced against alot of the factory honda USA riders. those stickers dont look familiar to me at all. they must be a european team. dean kirsten may have more info on the stickers. your picture reminds me of holland... the wet coblestone streets....

[stefan34]

thanks for the info the owner that hat the trike before me said that he bought it from a man who race't with it at the veronica beach race

[driscoll333]

yes, the veronica beach race is at sckavenegin. i was invited to holland by veronicaTV {bob dejong} that race is crazy.. i hole shoted the first race that 3wheelers were allowed. they had us start with the side hack motorcycles. the side hack guys laughed at us, and didnt want us racing in their moto. they said we were slow and would get in their way. me sundahl and fox kicked their ass'. i think there was 300 entries in that single moto!

[driscoll333]

your 3W looks like some of the 3Wers that were in that race. the europeans do their stickers and #s different than the americans.

[icp4life162005]

So what happened to Coe? Did Brett scare him off with the concussion story? He has not posted since December, whats up is he ok?

[SpeedyTide]

WOW!!! I'm 35, and grew up on 3-wheelers. Found & purchased an '85 250ES Big Red in LA. in Dec. of '05.

This site is great, and having Mike Coe....MAN...the memories!! I'm hoping to be lucky enought and acquire, preferably a 350X, but will take a 250R, to ride and race locally.

Look forward to hearing more stories Mike!! :TrikesOwn

Jeff

[CoeShow]

Brett Driscoll......... I've been away for awhile. I do remember my Yamaha experiences. Most of them anyway...... During the 1000. When Dean handed the bike over to me it was a pile. It was completely patched up. No skid plates, bent up, I know you can imagine because you rode some of the machine later.

Anyway, Deans toast..... none of the brakes worked. Something had fouled up the front brakes and the rear disc was so bent that it would "push" the pucks apart so it was not effective. Plus the smal light was wiped off it too.

If you will recall, we had it all planned to be in a certain pit before it got too dark, and if we fell a little behind we would still have the "small" light. We decide that I will try to nurse the Banshee along to the next pit where the main light rack is IN THE DARK! I am to follow other participants and use their lights t oget to the next pit, which actually worked pretty well considering.

That worked for a while. I don't remember a whole lot more other than after I got to the next pit and had the lights on I started reeling in Ray Schooley the leader. In fact, I had just caught up to him when we encountered a knarly Mexican speed bump.

Well, Ray had brakes. The rest is how you remember it. I think that the mexicans actually "clubbed" me more than I had gotten in a bad wreck. Anyway, yea i had some short term memory loss for a couple of days. It has mostly come back.

Besides, we did have an awesome time didn't we?? Ray and I teamed again the following year, 1988. The ignition gave out at the 1/2 way mark. We still had quite an adventure because some Mexicans stole the Quad off of the course!!

Thats another story, and the only one of my 7 Baja 1000's I DNF.

So Brett, How have you been?? How is the Imperial Valley? Can I still get a pair of Vuarnet Sunglasses from your store?

Mike

[driscoll333]

hey mike, its been along time, its great to hear from you. i didnt know the whole cuncusion story. glad u cleared that up. it wasnt funny at the time, but it is now.. we should have teamed in a few more races before we called it quits. I.V. is still hot and dusty, but still home. next time u come thru, u better stop by my store. vuarnet's are out... spy, arnette, VZ, oakley's are in!! and rayban's are back in style..hahaha.. keep in touch.. brett

[CoeShow]

Brett,

It was probably funny then too! I have had a number of fellow racers recall that race and all of the repetitive questions I kept asking. I have been around others that have sustained mild head injuries and know what it's like to be on the other side. It can be funny! As long as you know the rider is not suffering from any major injuries.

I don't even remember why you didn't race with Ray and myself the following year at the 1000. Did you compete at all in 88 or did you see the end was near too? My wife became pregnant with our first child in 1988.

I called the SCORE Riverside race that year my final event. I raced a YZ250 powered Banshee that broke during the race. I did come out of retirement in 1993 to compete in and win the Pikes Peak Hill Climb event. That event and win was probably one of my most memorable victories! Have you ever been to the Pikes Peak race? It was awesome. I hear the environmentalists are still trying to shut it down. It is nearly paved all the way to the top now so it is nothing like it used to be 10+ years ago...... Oh well. Thats progress right?

I'll PM you with my regular e-mail address.......

Mike

[GREGMCKEE]

Hi Mike....
Amazing how this thread just keeps on smokin' along...
I read the whole thing yesterday and the inside stories you have shared have been awesome!!

I noticed somewhere along the line you said that for the most part your 250R's were stock to start with and then were modified. I remember seeing pictures in some of the magazines I believe from 1984 where some of the 250R's had what looked like a radiator shroud mounted to the (right) side. Can you confirm this? Was that in response to the debut of the Tecate? I will have to dig through the old mags and try to scan a pic. So from what I understand you guys didnt get a lot of "works" stuff like the MX guys did. I remember reading that someone from Team Honda saying that the Ohtsu tires were not very good. They sure looked cool though!
I can also remember back to when you all had to switch to the Hondaline jerseys and pants...they were about the ugliest stuff going at the time...I remember thinking "Those poor buggers!"

Well Mike I want to thank you for setting the record straight about the crap that went on in 1985. I have to admit that I was one of the many people who jumped on the Marty Hart bandwagon, but I always knew that you were champion material too. I do have to mention that I never saw any of you race, just read about you in the magazines...but you inspired me to get on my uncles ATC200 and race it at a fair (taking the win...) and parlayed that into a 4 year racing sponsorship with a local shop. You gave me something to aspire to and for that and the memories I have from racing, I say thanks!

[CoeShow]

Greg,

We did receive some parts from Japan to convert our 3 wheelers to water cooling. Japan sent custom side covers with water pumps, cylinders, heads, and a few other goodies.

A friend of mine fabricated all of the radiator mounting hardware and shrouds.(He also modified our gas tanks for increased turning radius) Another friend made all of the radiators.

The engine was already designed to be water cooled, as the CR's had been since 1982 I believe. It was ALL in response to the release of the Kawasaki! And know this. No Ohtsu tire that I ever used was as good as the available Hoosiers. I could have won even more races had I been able to use Hoosier tires if I wanted! But since we were winning some on Ohtsu's, most believed they must be great simply because they weren't aware that we HAD to run them, not because we chose to!

As far as my commentary about the 1985 season, its all true. I want to reiterate that I have absolutely no hard feelings toward Marty Hart. He was and is a true Professional, and was one hell of a competitor. He is still involved in varying avenues of off-road competition and I see him every now and then on TV. He was involved in Rock Crawling, and I understand he is racing some class of pick-up truck too in the C.O.R.R. series.

But he did suffer some misfortunes and problems during that season, had a lot of bad luck and would not have won the championship without Honda changing things as they saw fit. Since the 1985 season was the first that the AMA was running, (Doug Richards was a FAR better promoter!) the AMA was in Hondas back pocket at the time. Honda ran the show, no question. Honda ATC knew they were going to reduce the team at year end and under nearly no circumstance was Marty not going to be the champ!

It was Honda management that was to blame for all of the BS, and in my opinion, Bruce Ogilvie was one of the biggest to blame. It was an unfortunate series of events (for me) and many know how Honda forced us into moving away from our long time sponsors and to use Honda products and Paul Turner engine components exclusively (slow). That along with the two earned points changes during and at the end of the season was a bad deal.

All in all, the good times clearly outweighed the bad! But even as the years tick by, myself and many others who raced then know the real score........

Mike

[driscoll333]

hey mike , when are we going to the dez? give me a call. ok set me straight on the ohtsu's. there was a big speedway race in el centro, and marty and 3 or 4 ohtsu guys tested on my private track for hours. im pretty sure they had several different compounds. if i remember right they didnt offer different compounds to the public. or was that only for marty?

[CoeShow]

Brett,

Hows it goin'? Ohtsu had SO many tires, compounds, and tread designs it was crazy! Their problem was twofold. 1 none of the tire carcasses ever held a decent shape, and 2 the tires wouldn't hold an edge! I know I completely shredded so many Outsu's testing it wasn't funny. Marty did too.

The two Japanese tire guys that Honda sent over busted their asses trying to make a competitive tire. You may have known this, but Ted and Mat grooved MOST of our early tires from blanks!! Those guys were awesome with a tire iron!

When the production tires showed up, they NEVER worked as good as Hoosiers. NEVER. But we had to run them. We did have a few different compunds to choose from bu none of them worked well. Their production desert tires were great, but the flat track tires sucked big time. At least mine did.

Because I know how Marty got preferential treatment with all of Paul Turners engine mods and ATC 500R frame tricks, It wouldn't surprise me to learn that he also had access to his own special sets of Ohtsu race tires too.

I rarely go riding in the dez any more. The only time I go by there is when I'm on my way to Phoenix or Tucson. Too many idiots. Part of that is the states fault by not opening up more riding areas with all of that green sticker money they spend on everything else. I read in the paper recently where that may soon change! Looks like the Governator signed a bill that will hopefully make some much needed improvements for the off-road community!

Ever been to Gorman? You've probably driven past it numerous times on the I-5 over the years. Some of the best trail riding around! I got bored of the Dunes, Ocotillo, and Ocotillo Wells years ago. Its still O.K. riding, but I wanted to explore some new stuff. Somewhere I hadn't ridden a 100 times before, and where its still pretty remote. Its nice only seeing maybe 6 other riders during the whole day!

[Twilight]

Mike, I know this is off-topic. But did you ever have a chance to drive a Honda Pilot? Or get a chance to race them?

[CoeShow]

Twilight,

I drove and perfomed many tests for the original Honda Odessey. I have also driven a few Pilots as well. I find it funny that Honda re-used those names for some of their more current mini van/SUV autos.

Anyway, I NEVER raced them.

Mike

[Bryan Raffa]

and there Big Red is now a MUV:rolleyes:

Hey Coe been rideing at all? See any old racers lately?

You might know this also.. what are these rear fenders on this 200x...

[FreakinColeBuil]

I was wondering if anyone would know where i could get a copy of Wiseco AATVA cross country national championship video from 1985 or any atc videos from the 80's I cant seem to find any... Videos of Lake George atc races back then or just anything...??

[CoeShow]

Bryan Raffa,

Its been a while since i've been logged on.

The picture in your post is of Curtis Sparks, that I know for sure. There were a couple vendors that made "lowered" fibergalss rear fenders for ATC 250R's and also for the 200X. Dean Sundahl sold many through his SRP business for a while, but I don't recall if he had one for the 200X.

Anyway, the fender in question is a fiberglass aftermarket "race" fender designed to be used with the flat track tires. You might try a search, but I don't know of anyone making them now. They could always be made of plastic like any of the other reproduction parts made for trikes these days.

The only rider I stay in semi contact with is Curtis Sparks. I do continue to ride, but mainly ride my modified CRF230. I did some riding with Donny Luce a couple of years ago, and continue to request a ride with Curtis, but it seems more and more difficult to match schedules these days with family planning, work etc.

Good luck and ride safely.

[az350xer]

Mike,
Hey man, I'm an old fan from way back! Back when I was a teenager all I wanted to do was race ATC's because of guys like you, Brett, Gary and others. I just ran across a cool picture of you at Legends 2000. Most of those other guys were wearing Troy Lee jerseys and other modern stuff, but there you were with ATC pants and an old school JT chest protector! That was awesome man!

[CoeShow]

az350xer,

Thanks for your comments. The amazing thing was all of my old stuff still fit!! I have tried to maintain a "lean" body composition through the years. I think that living a healthy lifestyle and riding as often as possible does a body good....... Ride-on!

Mike

[scooterroo]

looks like lake george in the pic raffa.

[Epix FQX]

yes, the veronica beach race is at sckavenegin. i was invited to holland by veronicaTV {bob dejong} that race is crazy.. i hole shoted the first race that 3wheelers were allowed. they had us start with the side hack motorcycles. the side hack guys laughed at us, and didnt want us racing in their moto. they said we were slow and would get in their way. me sundahl and fox kicked their ass'. i think there was 300 entries in that single moto!


i'm also from the netherlands.
and to inform you the veronica beach race is back since 2 years.
its called the red bull knock out now but they don't alow quads in it these days.

i do have an old pic from back in the day it has banshee's, 250r's and quadzilla's in it.

pretty cool ill try to post it up here.

maybe the name Ton Maessen brings up some memories or Will van der Laan they are dutch racers from the 80's.

[Epix FQX]

i do have more pictures but they are from the motorcycles this is the only pic i have from the quads.

[driscoll333]

im from california USA. but i raced in holland twice . schavenigan and amsterdam veladrome stadium indoor. the pic is cool , i loved that race. it sucks they dont let ATVs race anymore...hey COE did u ever race in europe?

[CoeShow]

Brett,

I was also invited twice but had conflicting schedules. I think Dean Sundahl or Wax or maybe both went over. You would know, once, maybe twice? I don't remember about them, but know I would liked to have gone. I remember the stories I heard from you and others and the Magazine articles made it seem like it was a blast. I had an opportunity in 88 to go too when I was racing a Banshee for Yamaha, but that trip didn't pan out either.......

[driscoll333]

hey mike, the logistics of those trips were a nightmare , and at the time i woundered if it was worth it. but after it was over, and i was back home in the good ol' USA, it was awsome. and it was one of the highlites of my 3wler days. i dont know if compares to your pikes peek experience though. its funny how we raced baja, parker, mikey thompson ,riverside ,carona ,barona, stadiums,even some speedway. and our funnest races were later in our carriers and un-expected. brett

[CoeShow]

Brett,

I would say that winning at Pikes Peak was awesome fun! The number of "celebrities" and big time racers that I met and talked to was great. If you ever get an opportunity to even go and watch the event please do so ASAP.

The "greens" are getting closer every year to ending this historic race and the end may soon be near. We went there to race in 1993. I had wanted to race my ATC250R there after winning the AATVA National at nearby Colorado Springs in 1985.

Anyway, I was a wreck on the starting line at Pikes Peak! I had the worst butterflys I EVER had! They were the size of Vultures. It was my most gratifying win as I had wanted to race there for many years and winning the event was very rewarding emotionally for me.

Having my brother Sam with me as my Crew Chief, fabricator, tuner, and well..... my brother, added even more to the win !! THAT was also very gratifying, as he has been involved with Hi-performance ATV's and motorcycles nearly his entie life. He was also an accomplished racer as well, winning a number of titles in his career. I think he was the "King" of Barona Oaks, taking the number one plate there a couple of times before the track was closed down.

Building the winning machine was special for him. He is one of the nations top engine builders and tuners, but NEVER takes the lime light and is very humble. He is currently heavily involved with side-by-side ATV's leading the R&D at Alba Action Sports since the owner there purchased his business a few years back.

He was shining brightly on that July 4th in 1993!! You know, Sam has aways been around lending a big hand in some way throughout my racing career. Hell, Sam IS the reason I started racing 3 wheelers! I owe much of my success to his support through the years.

Winning at Pikes Peak was an excellent way to truly retire "on-top" of the world .

Which race win or Championship are you most fond of?

Mike

[driscoll333]

thats cool mike, i never met your bro. but ive heard of him several times. last year i bought a rhino from ALBA. i probably walked right by him...i was thinking about doing a trophy-rhino,but never did it. c-ya brett

[driscoll333]

my biggest ....was the SCORE pionts champion in 84 or 85 (i think?). riverside was big , i got 2nd . but concidering i took major dirt samples there the year or two before. it was all about getting Yamaha on the podium. it was very hard because honda was so dominant. coe, hart, sundahl. u guys were wicked fast.

[brapp]

hey mike i have falloed his thread and have to say you are oen of my heroes form back int he day i rember beign 3 year sold and starting racign my atc 70in 87here localy but my real question is do you ahve any opinions on the terry cable fork kits for the 85-86 r's? and if you can maek ti to trike fest this year i got a real nice r for ya to tool around i would love to be out on the track with a legend!!!! thanks in adance

sincerly, josh a marshall .district 6 #160

[CoeShow]

Brapp,

It's nice we can converse here at 3 Wheeler World! I would REALLY like to make it to Trike Fest 2008. Has the date been posted yet? I understand that the event is held in Indiana, usually in June? I will get there one of these days.

[Bryan Raffa]

Mr Coe, yes it has been posted,http://www.3wheelerworldforums.com/showthread.php?t=74641

[CoeShow]

Raffa,

Thanks for the info. I'll see what I can do to get there this year.

Mike

[Bryan Raffa]

Raffa,

Thanks for the info. I'll see what I can do to get there this year.

Mike

hey mike.. theres a hotel in that one horse town..pretty close too where its held.. let me know if ya need the info, I'll get it for ya!;)

[Scott B]

Wow! What an awesome thread. I actually came across this website by mistake....nice mistake to make..lol. I read the thread by Dean and now this one. I appreciate both of you sharing your stories. I really miss those days.


Mike, you were definately my favorite rider when I was a kid. Its funny, but I can remember reading about you winning alot, then all the sudden, you didn't. Now it all makes sense! Its amazing how corporate BS was so rampant at that level...I can only imagine it is twice-fold now.

Someone was asking about fenders, I had some Maiers on my 250r that were low profile like that, might look into those...if they still make them.

Someone mentioned Cagivas. I can remember going to the nationals in Boyd, TX and seeing one there. He jumped the start, so they restarted and put him a bike length back. He still got the holeshot. That bike was FAST.


Jeb, sending you a pm, we are practical neighbors.

Scott

[EAT_A_450]

HondaATC,

The "powervalve" or "ATAC" system if I remember correctly, was a chamber located on the left side of the cylinder. The system did not operate as designed for the CR, but the cylinder was still a giant improvement over the stock ATC cylinder and anything I was getting from Paul Turner at that time.

Like I mentioned in the previous post, Paul "ported" the cylinder and it made LESS power! Steve Carter then reassembled the top end using ATC rings which were chrome against this cylinder which was also chrome plated or nikasil. It self destructed during a National at Liberal Kansas in 1985.

If these cylinders are run "as is" the port timing is very good. They do not need to be modified if the correct pipe is used. This set-up was very fast when I originally used it.

NOS_350X,

I never looked at it like you mentioned, but yes, the ATC200R's rear axle arrangement was very similar to how a motorcycle rear wheel is designed.

But even the motorcycle doesn't have to have the countersprocket located anywhere different. Kawasaki's and Yamaha 3 wheeler engines will interchange with their motorcycle counterparts. In fact, Kawasaki 500 and YZ 490-500 engines use the same motor mount sizes and locations so these engines will "bolt in."

I feel if the 3 wheeler era didn't come to the demise that it did, Honda would have brought this design to market on the 250's. The ATC200R was really a "works" 3 wheeler! No question about it! There were a number of re-designed and improved elements on these trikes that no doubt would have trickled down to the production 3 wheelers in the next year or so "if" they hadn't been banned......

Should this thread be moved to Trikesylvania??

Coe, awsome thread- it's 4am and I'm still reading. You said with the right pipe the stock atac cylinder is "very fast". What would be a good pipe? I know you have bad blood with pt as you should but it is the best pipe now for the 250r cylinder. I have 1 of those as well as a DG and FMF all with silencers. Also what year cr silencer? stock or aftermarket- does it make a big diff? Did you bypass the atac all together? I'm trying to build a killer woods bike but I also want to be the fastest in an old fashioned field(drag) race. Thanks for this great thread!! I've learned a ton!

Cory

[CoeShow]

Cory,

Pipes are VERY rider specific. What is "awesome" for one, is a dog for others so you will need to do some experimentation to decide what suits your taste.

When I was racing back in the mid eighties, my testing showed that Klemm Research's pipe was the overall "best" power producing pipe (for me). No Paul Turner pipe ever worked as good as others.

The entire PT pipe line were all dogs IMHO.

Of course trying to find a Klemm pipe today would be like finding a needle in a hay stack! Eddie Sanders probably has a good 3 wheeler pipe. I would inform you to get a Sparks Racing pipe but I don't think he makes one for the
ATC250R, only quads.

Good luck and ride safely.

[EAT_A_450]

Mike, thanks for your help what type of race did you run the atac jug on? mx? Was it faster than any ported 250r jug that you ran? I've read where the newer cr-powervalve jugs will fit but you have to do some case mods and bypass the powervalve which gives you plenty of top end but kills the bottom end and I'm hoping that the atac jug won't do that but It's hard to find riders with hands on experience. The only other rider that I talked with about it (I lost contact with) was a dune rider- he said that it would smoke any ported 250r jug in the dunes but I never got to ask him how it ran on bottom end.

[CoeShow]

Cory,

The ATAC cylinder was a good choice over a stock cylinder. It worked far better than a stock ATC cylinder, but the best I ever ran was the Japanese special race cylinders. They were the best overall.

The ATAC cylinder also had a different head sealing design that was somewhat problematic. I had some head gasket issues while using the ATAC cylinder/head. The design was changed in later cylinders, but the newer CR cylinders don't interchange like the 84 ATAC does.

If it where me, I would opt for a modified ATC/quad jug. I feel they are more reliable after being modified and when added compression is used.

Mike

[MTS]

Hey mike,

Just curious if you ever ran the Canadian circuit of the ama trike supercross.....??

[CoeShow]

my trike sucks,

I never raced in Canada, but I did race in Alaska! I raced and won many AMA supercross races. Some of the races were held during the break between motos.

Later on we raced "after" the motorcycle races were over, like at 0-dark thirty and almost all of the spectators had left.

The best combination of mixing bikes and trikes was when we had a race along with the AMA dirt track series.

3 wheelers were much better suited to that type of track. When we raced at the Supercross races the 3 wheelers were laughed at more than appreciated. When watching a 3 wheeler limp around a worn/grooved out track after watching the bikes do the triple jumps, it's no wonder!

When we raced the flat track and TT tracks, the 3 wheelers ran equal and better lap times than the bikes! The spectators loved it!

I don't know why the AMA never combined the two series. Maybe the 2 wheeled dirt track racers felt the 3 wheelers would put on an even better show.......

I would come out of retirement if they ever held an ATV race at the AMA Peoria TT. Have you ever seen that race?
It used to be awesome! I don't know if it's still on the circuit, but many would race and win on MX bikes fitted with dirt track tires because the jumps were so big!

Good luck and ride safely.

[Dammit!]

Cory,

The ATAC cylinder was a good choice over a stock cylinder. It worked far better than a stock ATC cylinder, but the best I ever ran was the Japanese special race cylinders. They were the best overall.

The ATAC cylinder also had a different head sealing design that was somewhat problematic. I had some head gasket issues while using the ATAC cylinder/head. The design was changed in later cylinders, but the newer CR cylinders don't interchange like the 84 ATAC does.

If it where me, I would opt for a modified ATC/quad jug. I feel they are more reliable after being modified and when added compression is used.

Mike


I thought it was the 1985 CR250 cylinder that swapped onto the trike. Are you sure it's the 1984?

[Billy Golightly]

Hey Mike, you might have already seen these but if you haven't I thought you might enjoy seeing my 500R short track racer I built over the winter. I finished it up in March, ran a couple races with it and really pleased with it. 90% of the fab work is my own, including the pipe sectioning (Kinda dirty, but it was the first one I'd ever done). I wonder how much this would have been like the real ATC500R? Fun to think about.

http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s100/HondaATC/500R%20Flat%20Tracker/P1010032.jpg
http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s100/HondaATC/500R%20Flat%20Tracker/P1010024-1.jpg
http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s100/HondaATC/500R%20Flat%20Tracker/P1010039.jpg

[wildman]

Hello mike I have a question I just bought a couple 82 250r's one has a liquid cooled head that says leckich tuning, i took it to the machine shop and they said it was a 500 the guy i bought it from said he thought it was a 400 have you ever heard of leckich tuning ?

[EAT_A_450]

Mike,
you mentioned a hi wax seat as a mod- what exactly is a hi wax seat? Oh and I went with an Eddie Sanders 310 instead of the atac!

thanks again,
Cory

[3wlrtxn]

Hey Mike, did you ever race in the AstroDome in Houston, I raced ATC's around TX. and I've heard your name before I think we even met in AZ. onec, did you race in the Micky Thomson sieres I did that tour in 86 I was 16 at the time.
after that I went on to race quads.

[CoeShow]

Gentlemen,

I will try to answer the last questions as they were posted. Sorry I haven't logged on lately, but much is happening as of late.

Damnit,
I don't think that the 1985 CR cylinder will "bolt-on" to the ATC lower end. If memory serves, the bolt pattern was slightly changed. The ATAC cylinder (84?) was a direct fit.

Billy,
Your creation is likely very similar to what Honda was contemplating. The only "racer" to ever ride the trike was Marty Hart. Team Honda was allowed to disassemble and take critical measurements of the frame and other components as there were significant changes.

We incorporated many of the improved geometry numbers into our production ATC250 frames for improved handling capability.

Wildman,
Leckich does sound familiar but I do not recall what they marketed.

Eat_a_450,
The seat in question was a seat that incorporated a MUCH thicker foam section along with the corresponding seat cover, similar to the ones you see used on mini/pit bikes used for adults. One of the Team Honda riders, Mark Weixeldorfer (Wax for short) marketed these seats along with others. We always supported Wax. I hope that is the info you're looking for.

3wlrtxn,

I did race in the AstroDome! I raced in Texas many times through the years. I also competed in and won many Mickey Thompson events, but never followed the entire series to win the championship as Team Honda raced in many different areas and tracks. The only Mickey Thompson events I competed in were in California.

Honda also would not compete on the "Traveling Circus" that employed portable steel ramps for jumps that were built on concrete racing surfaces that Mickey Thompson promoted in many cities. I will add that Mickey and Trudy Thompson were close to me. They treated me like their son. They were awesome folks.
Like you, I also began racing quads in 1986 as the ATC team had been disbanded except for one 3 wheeler rider, Marty Hart, and one 4trax rider, Steve Wright. There was NO Team Honda is 1987. I had a Pro Support deal from Suzuki in 1986 where I won many races on an experimental LT250. I then signed with Yamaha for the 1986 Baja 1000 where the "Banshee" was introduced. The Banshee's finished 1-2, beating Team Honda.

I raced for Yamaha through the 1988 season when I retired from Professional ATV racing. Yamaha informed me they were pulling the plug at the end of 1988. I was likely the last "Full Factory" ATV racer thanks to support from Yamaha.

[BenSchlimme]

Wow!!! So just doing some reminiscing with some random internet searching on ATC250R's and stumble across this thread with Mike Coe.

Spent the day reading all the posts to get caught up and glad to see some of the old timers are still posting - Mike, Brett & Dean K.

Mike, I am "former" ATC racer a few years younger then you but raced the '85-'86 AATVA Nationals in the Amateur class on my Honda ATC250R when I was 16 & 17. I didn't do all the races but in '86 I finished I think 3 or 4th behind Charlie Sheppard, Donnie Wilson and think it was Alan Mathis maybe 3rd.

My first national was at Porterville, CA in 1985. I think that was the year that you, Mike had a pretty big get off at the end of the front stretch and came back with a pretty wadded axle and helmet. May have a picture of that one but bet you really don't want to see it.

Had a great time watching the pros like Mike, Curtis, Marty and Rodney kick some serious tail on the competition. It was cool to finally learn that I was right, in Columbus Ohio for one for the nationals(20 second laps), that the funky frame Marty was running was NOT stock. You could see it was not stock but I thought AATVA at the time mandated it. Anyway, Marty and Jimmy tangled over the one jump and I thought blows were going to happen.

Interesting stories about all the politics. I was just a small town kid from Tucson that would go to the races in a truck with my dad and I did all my wrenching and setup. I felt fortunate to get some help from Paul Turner at the time in the form of his "trick" welded up transfer port cylinder for my 1985(still have that one in a box in my shop) and for me on my '86 I had one of the CR cylinders that was a rocket. Pulled the hole shot on the entire amateur filed in the AATVA San Antonio National in 1986 with that ATC and at the time Charlie Sheppard was supposed to be Paul's sponsored amateur but he didn't have one!! Last race he didn't. I think these did use the 85 CR cylinder with the small power valve chamber on the top of the cylinder not the big ATAC chamber like you are talking about Mike. Paul plugged the chamber with a machined aluminum piece. It was the fastest 3-wheeler I ever ridden but maybe would have been faster if Paul didn't port it. :) Grenaded that cylinder when I started running pro at a National at the LA Fairgrounds in 1986 and never ran the same.

I raced my 3-wheeler longer then most into 1986 in . Jumped on a quad late in 1986 and mainly did the Mickey's & SCORE in 1987. Highlight was a 250CC Class 24 win at the Baja 1000 with John Herder and Steve Melton. Then it was off to college in 1987. Big Parker 400 overall with John Herder in Class 24 for 1988 and a just over 50mph average. Think I got 5 or 6 Parker wins in total over the years. Back into quad racing from 1991 to 1995 in the SCORE and D38 events, teaming with Lance Schoonmaker late in my career in SCORE, then off to desert car racing(Class 10 and 1) in SCORE from then.

Mike - didn't you do a local Phoenix race at Manzanita speedway back in 1985 I think? I think I have a picture of you from that race that I need to dig up. We had some fast local ATC rider out of Phx with Tommy Brown and John Savinski then Greg Clark on the Suzuki Quad.

It's great to read about some of the behind the scenes guys I remember idolizing back in the day.

Brett - do you ever remember a guy named Mike Hayes I believe? He lived in Tucson back in the late 80's and I think new you. He "raced" a bit and somehow had a pretty good JT hook-up(probably you!!).

I've got many more stories but not quite as well known as Mike's and Brett's!!!

[NOS_350X]

My first national was at Porterville, CA in 1985. I think that was the year that you, Mike had a pretty big get off at the end of the front stretch and came back with a pretty wadded axle and helmet. May have a picture of that one but bet you really don't want to see it.


Porterville, Too bad they dont still have races there. You got any pictures from there? Its close to me so it adds a little more.

[BenSchlimme]

Porterville, Too bad they dont still have races there. You got any pictures from there? Its close to me so it adds a little more.

Porterville was crazy fast and a quality track. 6th gear final corner left for no more gears down the front stretch. I remember telling Rob Selvy that I could not pull 6th through the final turn with the gear I had, which many were running, probably 15/35 or 16/35.

He told me you should be in 5th in that corner anyway!!

I also remember I guy in an Odyssey that going down the front stretch would rock back and forth really hard. Looked totally goofy but by the end of the straight he could pull 1/2 to 1 length on the next guy!

Let me see if I can dig up my old pictures. I know I have some shots of me and also a shot of Selvy and his "crew". Just hope the wife didn't "donate" them to the dump. :(

I think I raced Porterville 2x but maybe I am dreaming. I remember the amateur race there was so mismanaged. We were lining up for the 250A main at something like 3:30AM believe it or not.

[CoeShow]

Ben,

Been a while since I last logged on! I did get off hard at Porterville. I actually totaled my trike. My mechanic Chuck Miller, who is now the Honda Race Team Manager, had to rebuilt it with a new frame up. Frame was toast, forks, swingarm, axle, everything was bent!

Chuck said that during one of the many flips that the trike was over 20 feet in the air. I was lucky to have not been seriously injured!

That sweeper at the end of the main straight netted speeds over 70 MPH (for my slow Paul Turner equipped trike) I know Eddie Sanders had at least 10 MPH on me there, but I think his engine expired early on.

During practice I remember I was all tucked in heading down the long straight trying to get everything I could out of my trike. Eddie Sanders pulls up along side of me sitting up straight, guns his trike a few times, and then easily pulls away and grabs another gear!! I was topped out! The engine I had there at Porterville was a DOG, as were most of my Paul Turner equipped trikes. I only ever had one that ran to my liking.

I had to race the last chance qualifier after the crash to qualify for the main. I believe I won the last chance qualifier which allowed me "choice" of the last row for the start. Even starting in the back I believe I finished 3rd or 4th in the main event.

On the flat tracks a fast machine was much more important than on the off-road tracks. I wish I could have run my DG prepared top ends!! I did have faster stuff from DG. Too bad I couldn't run DG Performance in 85.

Paul Turner could make fast stuff, but he focused solely on Marty Hart and catered to Marty's desires. I mentioned this before, but all I got to choose from for engine performance back then were Marty's cast-offs. They would test for days and keep the "good stuff". Chuck and I got the left-overs! Real "Teamwork". HA!!

People often asked me what it was like during that "get-off" at Porterville. That was the worst crash in my entire racing career. The best way I could describe it was to tell them, "If you want to know, get in the back of a pickup truck and jump out at 70MPH". That will give you a good idea!

Mike

[rdlsz24]

So that's you in these pics Mike?

http://www.3wheelerworldforums.com/Brochures/ATCsite/83atc250r.html
http://www.3wheelerworldforums.com/Brochures/ATCsite/83atcfl.html

[CoeShow]

The photos in the brochure are me, but the action photo is of Curtis Sparks. We were team mates in many SCORE Off Road Races. He is wearing my gloves though! (DG)

Mike

[Mickey Dunlap]

WOW! That was quite the read. Nice to see you are still alive and kickin Mike! I didn't read all of your posts but I never knew you lived in PA. My shop (Four Stroke Tech) is about 2 hours from where you lived. You remember alot more about the old days then I do.:postwhore :lol: Where are all the pics?

[Billy Golightly]

Wow! Mickey Dunlap, awesome! Welcome to the forum, hope we'll see ya around every now and then :welcome:

[Mickey Dunlap]

Wow! Mickey Dunlap, awesome! Welcome to the forum, hope we'll see ya around every now and then :welcome:

Thanks, a guy building my new website told me about this thread,so I came over to do a little facts checkin.lol

[NINJA]

Awesome, now we have another legend joining the boards. WELCOME:beer

[Mickey Dunlap]

Awesome, now we have another legend joining the boards. WELCOME:beer


More infamous then legend I'm afraid:naughty:

[edog]

More infamous then legend I'm afraid:naughty:




Welcome to one of the best 3 wheeler sites on the net!!!!!

[HondaHarry]

welcome to 3ww Mr. Dunlap!
HH

[Red Rider]

Welcome aboard Mr. Dunlap. We're glad you could join us. :beer

[ATCeeya]

just read through the thread..interesting stuff and very cool to hear stories from the racers themselves.

[Mickey Dunlap]

Thanks for the welcome. When I get some time I will try to post up some pics of things you might not have seen before. Might be kind of hard because from looking around you guy have it coverd real good.:D

[edog]

Thanks for the welcome. When I get some time I will try to post up some pics of things you might not have seen before. Might be kind of hard because from looking around you guy have it coverd real good.:D

Any vintage pics you post would be great!!!!!

Do you have any trikes currently?

[blue27]

Glad to see your here Mickey, we need to see some pics and you need to share some of those war stories I remember,lol.

Thanks

[Dammit!]

Got any pics of Honda's prototype ATC 500R ?? :D

[Tri-Z 250]

fantastic read, thank you very much for your input on the boards, Welcome to you and Mr. Dunlap look forward to future posts from you two.

[Mickey Dunlap]

Thanks for the welcome guys, I'm trying to find pics that you may have never seen but you guys are so hard core I don't know if it's possible:D

[SWIGIN]

i think Mickey needs his own sticky thread on here.

i dont exspect you to even remember the track let alone me but in the mid 90s for practice for sundays local mx races we used to run at hillvalley on saturday nights. (near path valley)

long story short, we were hanging in the pit just waiting for it to start and a truck comes pulling in with a built up mojave in the back. we hardly ever seen kawis at races so we went over to check it out and turns out you get out of the truck with a rider.

i always wanted to know how you even heard about that little old track?

[Mickey Dunlap]

i think Mickey needs his own sticky thread on here.

i dont exspect you to even remember the track let alone me but in the mid 90s for practice for sundays local mx races we used to run at hillvalley on saturday nights. (near path valley)

long story short, we were hanging in the pit just waiting for it to start and a truck comes pulling in with a built up mojave in the back. we hardly ever seen kawis at races so we went over to check it out and turns out you get out of the truck with a rider.

i always wanted to know how you even heard about that little old track?



:lol: Well I don't know where I was, but I do remember. I had just built a customers Blaster(don't tell anyone I built a 2 stroke) and he asked me to come up and see him race. I hated going to races and not riding so me and a freind took 2 Mojave out of the shop and followed him for 2 or 3 hour up in the hills somewhere. It took us 5 hours to get home:lol: I believe I won some money that night so it was all good:naughty:

[Daddio]

Welcome to the boards Mickey. My son 1upfront here on the boards and I have something in common with you that is not trike related. We are also Dunlaps.:D

[Mickey Dunlap]

Welcome to the boards Mickey. My son 1upfront here on the boards and I have something in common with you that is not trike related. We are also Dunlaps.:D

I only know of one other Dunlap family on the east coast,well two now:lol: :w00t: :w00t:

Here's something you might not know, the owners of Web Cam are Dunlap's too. :p

[atvmxr]

wow, we got some big names on here!! i met Jimmy White a couple years ago at a quad wars. my dumb ass was so stoked to be racing in the astrodome, it didnt even click that he was THE jimmy white. oh well. old school ATC racers rock.:TrikesOwn



dunlap, you still building the 350x motors???

[bittner5454]

Hey mike glad you joined. I was just wondering if you could help me. I have a 1985 200x and am looking for a pipe to put on her. You recommend anything?

[Bryan Raffa]

Hi coe.. care to share some info on this 350 powerd R? looks like the pipe go's down under the cradel.. Could Jimmy catch you on that?:naughty:

[mjquadracer]

Saw you race jimmy white in phoenix in 85. that race changed my life. Man that was the coolest thing i had ever seen. I just got an 85 tecate and my broyher in law just got an 85 250r. after watchin that race it was on!! M.C. was jumping so far it looked painful. I never saw a 3 wheeler jump that far!

[scooterroo]

Hi coe.. care to share some info on this 350 powerd R? looks like the pipe go's down under the cradel.. Could Jimmy catch you on that?:naughty:

come on now raffa, didnt you read the caption under the picture? :wondering :rolleyes: :beer :lol: :welcome:

[mjquadracer]

I got an old video of mickey dunlap at the florida national in 85. I dont know what happened to him in the 200 race but him and steve wright were batteling and on the last lap, dunlap slowed way down. Then wright tried to pass him and dunlap almost parked him! it was hilarious. I didnt think a three wheeler could do that! I think his engine locked toward the end cause he dropped way back. Then in the 250's he pulled the holeshot but got red flagged. then on the restart hart totally jumped but didnt get red flagged (go figure)! But it was the most awsome race I'd ever seen. It might have been a crappy track but I thought the racing was awsome. sparks show boated on the last lap of the 200x race and stalled the motor! he was posing for a picture! Quads just cant battle like three wheelers did.

[mjquadracer]

some pics of coe

[mjquadracer]

one at riverside

[rdlsz24]

Hey Mike I have a Dirt Wheels from late 2000 that has an article with you in it. It was a legends race on quads. I will have to scan it in and post it here.

Rob

[Mr.Atc]

did you get to race a 250r?i race my 85 250r alot on the ice and a little bit in the summer

[rdlsz24]

Came across this ad and it's one I haven't seen online before.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v603/rdlsz24/ATC/Coe.jpg

Rob

[CoeShow]

Hey everyone, I hope you're all well. Haven't logged in for awhile. I'll answer the latest questions.

1. Mr ATC. I primarily raced Honda ATC250R's. I also raced modified ATC's of varying displacements and different engines.

2.Bryan Raffa. That down pipe equipped 350cc "Open-Class" 3 wheeler was very powerful and fast. However, its a good thing Jimmy White didn't enter the open class that day as he likely would have won that too. At that race in San Jose, it was all about who could spin the tires the fastest. The entire track was a blue groove and traction was at a premium. Jimmy White and his crew came up with a different tire or treatment that gave him at least some measure of traction during the main events that contributed to his apparent "easy" victory in the 250 class main event. I'm not taking anything away from Jimmy White's victory that day. He taught us ALL a lesson and it was a HUGE victory for him, deservedly so. I can say though that his win wasn't due to the fact that his trike was faster, or more powerful, or that he out rode every one that day. Simply put, Jimmy had traction and nobody else did! Look at that trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro eating grin on his face from the popular photo of him near the finish of the race! Who was the smartest that day? Jimmy White. While I had some dirt track tires and bead locks mounted on that 350, the compounds available were still like riding on ice. I did win the open class race that day with some pressure applied by a privateer named George Neary riding an XR500cc special. But if this very trike were at Competition Hill (Glamis) with a good set of paddles, there was likely no other equally displaced 3 wheeler that would have ran with it. It HAULED.

[trikerooster]

Welcome, Mike. It must have been awsome racing for HONDA.
I love the old honda ATC riding gear. I own a 82' R and just love it. I put an 85' front end and minor extended swinger. I can see cutting the tank because i have the metal tank w/ 85' forks. Every time I paint it chips first turn.
I have been interested in making a ATC jumping+frestyle video because you just can't find them. I remember jumping a 200x 60ft.
OLD SCHOOL IS THE WAY= I still can't believe MIKE COE You are the man!

[trikerooster]

I want some of that riding gear. I will keep my eyes open for gear like that.

[85KM]

This really brings back some good memories! My brother and I raced some of the national stuff with our Twin City Honda team out of MN. We actually won some of the amature national stuff. San Jose on Stevey "too tight" Wright's 125 that Honda gave to us actually won under my butt!! Beat Jackie Meadows to the finish! I believe we had a we also were given a Tommy Gaian custom chassis 125 which we first raced in the Tacoma Dome and it scared the crap out of me! My brother and I had a tricked out 200X mod and a 200R that was really cool up until about five years ago when someone stole them right out of our yard. Mine was the 200R. I don't know what good it would do someone when it blew up because parts are unobtainiium. Set back tank, wide axel, Low profile ohtsu tires, no alternator. It was an 85 chassis and had 200R on the seat...not many like that. If anyone see's it let me know. Pretty rare! Last seen in White Bear Lake, MN.

Wish I could find that old white 125R!!

[85KM]

I'm sure in the bottom of some box somewhere.

[80JM]

I might have some pics. Let me see what i can dig up.

[80JM]

Here's a picture taken at a dome race in Tacoma Washington. The two wheelers on the left are the 125's that American Honda gave us. I wonder if Mike recognizes them? I wonder if it's still supposed to be hush-hush?:rolleyes: I'm sitting on my 200x which was by far the fastest 200 four stroke out there at the time. We opened up a lot of eyes with that thing, including the pro team's.

[80JM]

Here's some of the earliest pics i have. ATC90's, 110, 185s(i think).

[80JM]

Here's some pic's from different national races.

[80JM]

A few more.

[NOS_350X]

It seems that back in the day most of the racing was out here on the west.

Now all the ATVA, EDT nationals are on the east coast, I cant touch any pros without driving for over a day. Its tough pulling together sponsors just to race here locally let alone go accrost the country to race. Not to mention flattrack or tt support seems to be droping like a rock. The future of it has me worried. MX and woods stuff seems to be going strong. I struggle to get guys to race let alone run the pro class here locally.

The setup you run on the trikes amazes me also, SLIDE SLIDE AND SLIDE SOME MORE
On a quad its about TRACTION TRACTION TRACTION until you rear pushes the fronts.
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g285/NOS_350x/IMG_4897.jpg




I still tear it up on the trike when i can.

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g285/NOS_350x/350xriverdale.jpg

[85KM]

Jon,

That's my 200X which at that time for some reason had the 125 seat and fenders shaken on to it. It was a pretty rough ride through those old mountains as I remember!

[trainingwheeler]

Wow is all ive got to say !!!!!!

[SneakyATC250R]

Amazing. Took me HOURS to read this all. I was born in 86 so reading this has showed me what ive missed. I Got an 83 250r when i was 12 and ive been hooked ever since. Just bought a really nice 85 250r that i plan on keeping forever! Mike Coe you are the man! A few videos can be found on youtube of you and many other pros racing in 85 check it out. I would give anything for your autograph on my 250R or helmet!!! You have no idea. Ill send a front fender in the mail!! LOL. Hearing everything you had going against you...and you still won like crazy!......im with you on the whole "what about the rider" thing. Skill trumps parts any day...power is nothing without control! I hope you know that to many many ppl you are a legend. A huge piece of motorcycle history. Even to ppl who werent even born yet. There should be a 3 wheeler hall of fame with you and your awesome 250r's in there.

[Macdiesel]

Mike I have been talking to Harry Klemm on another forum, he says HI, Im trying to talk him ito makin me a pipe or my trike Im waiting for a response Im praying real hard, I had no clue he sold Klemm and started Group K which if anyone else follows Jet skis Group K is the shiz nit

[xr132]

Hokey Dinah! Loads of sweet oldschool info....the kind i love! I'd REALLY like to see some more pics from from your ATC racing days Mr. Coe!

Hope things are a goin' good for you, and I hope the "Queen" of the computer gets a scanner soon! lol

[2Go-Fast]

It was an incredable time racing ATC's in the early through mid 80's!
I must admit that I have not read this thread from start to end.....YET.....but I read enough to nudge me to register and reply to the thread starter, and I would like to say I too have MANY good memories of the early to mid 80's and the days when the 3 wheelers were the thing! I will go back to the start of this thread and read it from top to bottom, (as well as a few other threads that I noticed when looking for this thread to respond in).

I get a chance to talk to Curtis every now and then, but other than that, the faces in the industry has changed enough that I don't get to talk to many of the "old school" guys these days. I was searching for the "Top 10 Crash and Burn" spreads from Dean's old mag when I happened into this site, and when I found some of the articles from "the day" it caused me to stop my search for the shot of Glen Isles SAILING over the top of the second camelback top, in the old Columbus Ohio National......(my understanding is that shot made the "Top 10 Crash and Burn" shots for all time)....but as much as I wanted to see that shot again, the thought of reading/posting about the the "old days" with people who ACTUALLY REMEMBER the track at Boyd, Texas......the Nationals at San Jose and Saddleback, the OKC WinterNationals, proved too good to pass up.

I talk to your brother on occasion, but I can't remember the last time I had a chance to talk about the old days......I'm kind-of looking forward to bringing out a few old memories.

Talk to you Soon Mike,
Calvin Pollet.......(used to be one of the old Cammex Racing Products guys).....lol

[Billy Golightly]

Calvin, welcome to the site! Big fan of yours from your cylinder business and a lot of your technical posts at Planet Sand, glad to have you here at 3wheelerworld!

[dcreel]

I must admit that I have not read this thread from start to end.....YET.....but I read enough to nudge me to register and reply to the thread starter, and I would like to say I too have MANY good memories of the early to mid 80's and the days when the 3 wheelers were the thing! I will go back to the start of this thread and read it from top to bottom, (as well as a few other threads that I noticed when looking for this thread to respond in).

I get a chance to talk to Curtis every now and then, but other than that, the faces in the industry has changed enough that I don't get to talk to many of the "old school" guys these days. I was searching for the "Top 10 Crash and Burn" spreads from Dean's old mag when I happened into this site, and when I found some of the articles from "the day" it caused me to stop my search for the shot of Glen Isles SAILING over the top of the second camelback top, in the old Columbus Ohio National......(my understanding is that shot made the "Top 10 Crash and Burn" shots for all time)....but as much as I wanted to see that shot again, the thought of reading/posting about the the "old days" with people who ACTUALLY REMEMBER the track at Boyd, Texas......the Nationals at San Jose and Saddleback, the OKC WinterNationals, proved too good to pass up.

I talk to your brother on occasion, but I can't remember the last time I had a chance to talk about the old days......I'm kind-of looking forward to bringing out a few old memories.

Talk to you Soon Mike,
Calvin Pollet.......(used to be one of the old Cammex Racing Products guys).....lol

I'm still amazed that Cammex was out of South Coffeyville, OK just a few miles from my house. Calvin, do you still work on motors?

[2Go-Fast]

I'm still amazed that Cammex was out of South Coffeyville, OK just a few miles from my house. Calvin, do you still work on motors?
Where are you located?........To answer your question on working on engines would seem a little to much like an advertisement, which is not why I am here, but yes....we are still building cylinders for ATV's, snowmos's, and a few bike engines....in fact, we have been building cylinders all along, we built the ProX cylinders for LA Sleeve for close to 20 years now, they have just "went the way of the 4-stroke" as far as the old TRX's.....and they have ordered less and less each year.

I don't know the rules about advertising over here yet, so I'll just leave it at that for now.

[dcreel]

Where are you located?........To answer your question on working on engines would seem a little to much like an advertisement, which is not why I am here, but yes....we are still building cylinders for ATV's, snowmos's, and a few bike engines....in fact, we have been building cylinders all along, we built the ProX cylinders for LA Sleeve for close to 20 years now, they have just "went the way of the 4-stroke" as far as the old TRX's.....and they have ordered less and less each year.

I don't know the rules about advertising over here yet, so I'll just leave it at that for now.

I live in Coffeyville, KS and I am always looking for someone that can build a quick 2 stroke motor. Especially someone local with years upon years of experience. I was just amazed to see an ad in 3Wheeling for Cammex, and that they were located in South Coffeyville.

[2Go-Fast]

I am always looking for someone that can build a quick 2 stroke motor..... I was just amazed to see an ad in 3Wheeling for Cammex, and that they were located in South Coffeyville.
We did VERY few of the actual builds "back in the day", as we were the manufacturer.....In those days, we sold our cylinder kits to the public, and to many different builders who all used their own "touch" to build for their riders.
We had a shop fire in early 85 that totally destroyed the shop, (as well as many of our patterns). It was latter found to be arson, but that was a couple of years after the fact....all we knew was that the shop was totally destroyed on a Sunday morning, we had no insurance, so it was basically a "start all over" process.
When we were able to get started back up building cylinders, we decided to only build and supply to a Dealer network and not do any retail sales at all. In fact, for the first 2 to 3 years we built Snowmobile cylinders, and fell completely out of the public view. Believe it or not, we are still building cylinders within 11 miles of you if you live in Coffeyville, we just keep a pretty low profile.....lol

[dcreel]

We did VERY few of the actual builds "back in the day", as we were the manufacturer.....In those days, we sold our cylinder kits to the public, and to many different builders who all used their own "touch" to build for their riders.
We had a shop fire in early 85 that totally destroyed the shop, (as well as many of our patterns). It was latter found to be arson, but that was a couple of years after the fact....all we knew was that the shop was totally destroyed on a Sunday morning, we had no insurance, so it was basically a "start all over" process.
When we were able to get started back up building cylinders, we decided to only build and supply to a Dealer network and not do any retail sales at all. In fact, for the first 2 to 3 years we built Snowmobile cylinders, and fell completely out of the public view. Believe it or not, we are still building cylinders within 11 miles of you if you live in Coffeyville, we just keep a pretty low profile.....lol

The crazy thing is how many times I have looked at your website longing for one of your cylinders for one of my Tecates. Never even knowing you are in the same town as my ex wife's mother. :-) It's a crazy world.. You guys makes some amazing cylinders. If I owned a Banshee or a 250R and wanted to haul @$$ I would have one of your cylinders. My hat's off to you guys.

[85KM]

Hey Calvin,

Some good times, HUH! I just turned 40 and have a little one on the way!!! Look at the page before this one as Jon has some old race photos on it. Dad just scanned and emailed a bunch to us. I will try to post. That's funny, you talking about the TCH Indy 600 cylinders.

Kevin Marois

[85KM]

96292962939629496295962969629796298

[dcreel]

Awesome pictures. Thank you

[2Go-Fast]

... you talking about the TCH Indy 600 cylinders.....Kevin Marois
The old TCH cylinders would have been some of the first cylinders after the fire.
That "Dad" you talking about would not be Bob Marois would it?.....If so, tell him I said hello.

I probably shouldn't even be posting in Mike's thread here, I will end up cluttering up a darn good thread with all this..."back in the day stuff"....lol

[85KM]

I think this whole website was created for the "back in the day" stuff. Yes, Bob. I will tell him that you said hello. Small world! I remember when you guys were playing with sand castings in the kitchen at our Forest Lake, MN house. How have you been?

[2Go-Fast]

I've been good, still my own worst enemy, (as anyone who has ever known me will probably tell you....lol). I still talk about that trip every now and then....standing in the middle of a frozen lake, holding a radar gun as some guy on a snowmobile goes buy about 4 feet away at 130mph!...After the first time, it dawned on me (a)....I AM STANDING ON A FROZEN LAKE!!!!......and (b)....THAT GUY JUST WENT BY ME AT 130mph.....FOUR FEET AWAY!!!.....lol

After the fire, all of our old AATVA movies, the old mags and all of our pictures were lost, so I have been trying to find any copies of that old material that I can find. One of my boys even had their birth announced in the back of one of those old rags........."those were the days".....lol

[85KM]

I have a bunch of the VHS movies that Dad would buy at the races. I even have the PRO stuff on Saturday night. I have to get them put on DVD soon. I think if I put them in the VCR it will eat them.

That guy that was flying by you on the lake was my brother when he was like 12 or 13 years old. Remember when he put the track studs through the heat exchanger and puked all the anti-freeze out going 130MPH?

[2Go-Fast]

Let me know if you do get those transposed to DVD as I have a place that we can upload them. I have a website hosted that I secured several years ago in case we decided to go straight to the public with any items.....we went to a Dealer network instead, so http://www.2go-fast.com is just sitting there unused......a perfect place to upload some big video files for people to view if needed.

The is only so many times I can watch the 3 or 4 races on youtube races....... :)

[tundrawillie]

I bought every magazine from 1980 on. 3wheelin, dirtwheels, 3wheelaction, 3&4wheelaction, etc. My mom said, "Don't waste your money." I kept them in mint condition, no dog-eared pages...nothing. Sold most of them on ebay several years ago. $60.00 to $75.00 each. Bought a mint condition '85 250R with the money. Needless to say, my mom realized I made a wise investment in those magazines.

[zeek]

Really Nice OLD photos!
Thanx for posting them!

CHEERS:beer
Kris

[CoeShow]

Hello everyone. I hope you're all well! I've been pretty busy with life and working my life away like crazy. My daughter says I'm going to be a "Grandpa' in February 2011. I still feel very well and could swing a leg over my ATC250R and go into battle with Jimmy, Marty, Dean, Donny and all of the former Pro's I used to battle with! At least for one lap! If any one has any questions, please ask away. I will try to check back more often.

Mike

[Eric250R]

Nice to see you still check in from time to time. Glad to hear all is well, but most of all, congrats on getting ready to be a grandpa!!!!

[Billy Golightly]

Mike, I was in San Diego in January for a group ride out at Gordon's Well. And as we were coming back to the airport we passed by Solar Turbine, and I remember saying to a few guys that was where you worked at! That was my first trip to San Diego and I liked it a lot. If you want to swing a leg over a bike, come on out to the Imperial Invasion ride. Its going to be in march though which might be bad timing for the Grand baby :( Check it out though and see if it might work into your schedule! http://www.3wheelerworld.com/showthread.php?116851-Imperial-Invasion-Head-Count!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!&goto=newpost#post926525

[Bryan Raffa]

one of my boys even had their birth announced in the back of one of those old rags........."those were the days".....lol

Nice,, I like that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! thanks for shareing with us!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Billy Golightly]

Mike, I re-posted a few of your posts into articles on the front page under our Vintage Race accounts section.

This post: http://www.3wheelerworld.com/showthread.php?40674-Atc-4-Me&p=275900#post275900

And also this one: http://www.3wheelerworld.com/showthread.php?40674-Atc-4-Me&p=274834#post274834

I'm trying to organize things better and make it where users can find posts like yours (and other accounts like Mike Hallet's desert racing stories, some of the ones Dean Kirsten has told, etc) a little easier than wading through page after page after page. I didn't think you would have a problem with it, since you hadn't edited the posts here any on the board and in this thread or deleted them. If you do, tell me and I'll take them out.

[CoeShow]

Billy,

No problem. I did go in and edit some of the stuff, mainly for typo's I found while re-reading them. I plan to look in more frequently so that members can ask questions that I can hopefully answer to aid in informing them about "Back in the Day" or perfomance questions they may have, or past racing experiences. I am looking to find an 85 or 86 ATC250R. I now have the room to restore one and set it up like one of my old racers. Just to inform anyone intertested, If anyone has a used ATC250R that seems a bit "different" because the seat bolts on instead of having the quick release as they all came with, that is because it is possibly one of our former Factory ATC250's with the optimized ATC500 copied frame geometry.

I am pretty sure mine and Marty's custom framed race bikes were sold to interested American Honda employees when the ATV race team was disbanded after the 1986 season. They have likely traded hands numerous times over the years. Anyways, if you own or know someone that has an ATC250R that has what seems like a custom forward mounted "bolt-on" seat, it's a sure sign it is a former ex Honda ATC Racing ATC250R. The seat appears to sit well forward of the original mounting location, only because it does. The fuel tank and radiators have been moved forward the same amount to keep the ergonomics correct. This mod made the trike much less wheelie prone and improved front wheel traction during cornering. This mod also allowed us to have more traction control in varying terrain. The ATC500 frame geometry was a clear improvement in the overall handling of these 3 wheelers. Keep your eyes open. If any one has one of these trikes or knows someone who does, it is clearly one in a million!

Mike

[Jez]

Hi Mike,

Great to see you back on the site. Is this one of the bikes with the 500 geometry you mention? I don't remember where I found the photo, but it looks to have bolted, forward mounted fenders........along with a whole host of other mods.

Cheers,
Jez

[CoeShow]

Jez,

That photo appears to be one of Marty's 1986 racers. You really can't see much of the changes in the photo because they are kind of suttle, but in person you can see the differences.

Mike

[sweetip2000]

Can I get your autograph ? Anyone who can handle 3 wheels the way you did is a skilled rider.
If I remember correctly 1986 was the beginning of a really bad slump in the economy. Similar to what is going on now. I was too stoned back then to remember most things but if you can tell us where we can watch some original ATC videos form the 1980's please let us know. Its a real treat to watch, Welcome to the web site. The guy who owns it Billy put a lot of time money and effort into keeping it alive. I am looking for a 1985 200X. I will be installing a 200S motor in it, If you hear of anything in NY let me know. Thanks. btw keep them kids riding on 3.

[CoeShow]

I'm not aware of many 3 wheeler videos that were made in the 80's. I do have a very professional one that I plan to send a copy to Saul over at Airfoolers.com The video has a full range of 3 wheel and odyssey content, along with the 250cc National Off Road Chapionship main event held in 1983 that I won. At that time, 3 wheel racing was VERY fun, but the politics had begun to creep in!

[tundrawillie]

Wow, was the fuel tank molded with an extension in it like that? I don't remember ever seeing anything like it. Mike, can you elaborate on the geometry of the ATC500R frame. I spoke over the phone with Marty a few years back. He mentioned some change in the rake of the steering stem. I'd love to know how the frames were modified.
Jez,

That photo appears to be one of Marty's 1986 racers. You really can't see much of the changes in the photo because they are kind of suttle, but in person you can see the differences.

Mike

[CoeShow]

Tundrawillie,

Honda took frame geometry numbers (rake) and went to a local shop that had fixturing capabilities. The shop then cut, rewelded and re- gusseted the steering stem of a production ATC250R frame into its new position. There were a number of other smaller alterations as well to accomodate the forward mounting of the fuel tank, radiators and other parts. Thats all I can recall about the frame changes. The work was professionally done and invisible to the eye under new paint and assembly. The fuel tank in the photo of Marty's racer is likely made of aluminum. It appears to be made to hold additional fuel volume over the std Honda optional plastic short course tanks and carries this fuel a little lower to find the space for the additional volume. I feel it was similar to what the works MX teams used to run on the bikes. While it may have looked "trick" and unique, I doubt there was any performance gain other than longer run time between re-fills. Perhaps there was a race with a long moto where the std. short course tank would not have allowed sufficient distance.

[Billy Golightly]

Mike,

Its funny we're talking about the ATC500R again now, because we were just having a discussion a few weeks back. http://www.3wheelerworld.com/showthread.php?119876-Holy-Grail-of-Trikes It got a little heated, the debate between it and a new in the crate 250R that was on ebay recently. I guess I'm the skeptic (Not that they ever were, but that one or more survived and are still around). Would sure love to be proven wrong though!

Hey did anyone else notice on that picture Jez posted, the pipe is on the left hand side like the earlier model 250Rs, instead of around the right hand side? The panel under the short track tank almost looks like its a heat or knee guard of some type for flat tracking but its on the wrong side for left hand turns?

[CoeShow]

In the photo of Marty's race trike, the pipe had to be made on the left side to clear the custom low fuel tank. It seems to me it would have been better and likely easier to build the low tank on the left side allowing normal clearance for the pipe and kick-starter. That way all of the available current pipes could still be used for tuning. Maybe Marty will inform us if he remembers someday.

[BenSchlimme]

Porterville, Too bad they dont still have races there. You got any pictures from there? Its close to me so it adds a little more.

Don't mean to hijack Coe's thread here so if it needs to be moved please do do.

Well it only took me 2 years to unearth my old pictures and not a ton from Porterville. Pre-digital didn't provide nearly as many. :)

Here are a couple.

The static one is me(105) with Charlie Shepard (126) next to me waiting for practice I believe.

[BenSchlimme]

Jez,

That photo appears to be one of Marty's 1986 racers. You really can't see much of the changes in the photo because they are kind of suttle, but in person you can see the differences.

Mike

Mike,
I remember racing the 2500cc Amateur class in Columbus, Ohio in ~1985. I remember seeing the modded ATC250R frame "works" bike you guys had at Honda there. Believe it was Marty's bike, like in the photo.

It was so easy to tell the frame had been modified by the rake of the forks. You could tell at 100 yards that frame was not stock.

AATVA allowed that back then? I thought there was a production rule to an extent or was it Honda's deep pockets that got it through cause I would bet dollars to donuts that Kawasaki would not stand for it!!!

Don't remember seeing it run much after that though.

I also remember when Honda disbanded the entire race program - was the end of 1987 or early 1988. We had desert support from Honda in '87 and had won the 250cc 4-Wheel class at the Baja 1000 that year.

Bruce O' called me up to say they were "liquidating" their supplies and to come on down. I was like a kid in a candy store. All pretty much stock stuff but got a truck load of parts. Only wish I had my Ohtsu desert tires in state as he was swapping any old tire out for the new ones. I know the Ohtsu tires for short course were junk but the desert ones were hands down better than anything else.

I wasn't privy to any actual machines at that time and I imagine you had to be further inside than I was. Likely got transferred from the dumpster to someones truck. :)

All this ATC reading/talk I think I'm going to have to find a way to get one back in my collection....

[CoeShow]

Ben,

I'll have to disagree with your comparison of how noticeable the frame changes were to the trikes. I also rode a race trike with the same frame mods as Marty, so we both raced them. Again, while you could tell differences between a stock and modified with trikes side by side if I were to point out all of the suttle differences. By itself, it wasn't that obvious. To me the biggest tell-tale was that the seat cushion was mounted (bolted instead of latched) noticeably forward of the plastic part of the rear fender. Besides, the changes WERE small. You can't alter the rake too much and still use the same triple clamps and forks without affecting the handling in a way that would hurt performance.

I can tell you from experience that the forward mounting of the tank, seat, radiators and other components influenced better performance than the slightly steepened rake. If I would be doing this today, I wouldn't even waste the time and effort it took to modify the steering stem. That part of the mod provided the least improvement IMHO. There were other frame mods that altered the engine mounting location and other elements of the entire trike, more than just the steering stem angle.

As far as the rules, I don't know. We had used complete custom one off chromemoly chassis' built by Nick Nicholson and my brother Sam. There were never any issues that I can recall. It was really all evolutionary on the ATC250R. The changes would have most likely been incorporated into following year production trikes had they continued to be manufactured. The Honda engineers were very sharp. The custom "works" cylinders were made from custom modified cylinders that we used to race with. (most of custom Paul Turner ones I had were SLOW) The production JAP cylinders were great right out of the box. These cylinders would also likely been incorporated into following year trikes as well. I believe that the works ATC200R style swingarm and axle design would have been introduced with a 1988 ATC250R version had the trikes not been discontinued.

[Jez]

Hi Mike,

Went through a couple of my old magazines last night and found this picture of you on a late '84 model 250R that looks to be watercooled. Is this one of the bikes you mention earlier in this thread? It looks very trick! Can you shed any more light on it??

Thanks for spending the time to answer these threads. It's great to have you on the site.

Cheers,
Jez

108753

[Jez]

Also found these:

108754108755108756

[CoeShow]

Jez,

Wow, I had forgotten about those! Honda of Japan sent over left side covers equipped with water pumps along with quite a number of water cooled, nikasil plated cylinders and matching cylinder heads designed to fit the early air-cooled engines. I had a friend of mine who owned (still owns!) a radiator shop, custom make a half dozen or more radiators that would fit along the right side of the frame below the tank. with a simple hoop welded to the frame and a few rubber mounts and simple aluminum shroud and hoses, POOF, water-cooled ATC250R!! Everyone knows the benefit of water cooling. It enabled the engine to run harder, longer, while making more power without over-heating and slowing down. I designed all ofthe components myself and had my buddies and brother fabricate all of the necessary external parts. All of the engine components were bolt on items. No alterations to the engine were required to accept the water cooled parts. To be perfectlly honest, I liked the power delivery of the 70mm bore and 64mm stroke 250 engine better than the soon to be released 85 ATC250R's long 72mm stroke with 66mm bore engine design. DG Performance ported some VERY strong cylinders and we made some excellent working pipes as well. Again, these engines really ran well and IMHO were better suited for ATC racing.

The additional pictures are cool as well. The girl is my wife(ex now), Miss Parker and Miss AZ. runner-up, Samantha Roper. The pictures of the trikes are of Marty and me at Riverside 1985. A real battle royal. Well, not really. I would battle to pass Marty through the rough sections of the track, only to have him blow by me down the long "Thompsons Ridge" straightaway section of the course. I can remember getting into 6th gear down this straight, getting tucked in and Marty would go by me with at least 10 mph more speed and pull away by about 20 yds. before the end of the straight. The finish line was right around the turn following Thompsons Ridge, so Marty won both moto's. We went back and forth every lap. I would be leading coming onto Thompsons Ridge and Marty would pass me easily down that long straight, every time! Very dissapointing. It was so very clear who had the power. It made me sick and ANGRY, but I HAD TO RUN TURNER (junk) PARTS. Marty's trikes were always noticeably faster than mine during most of the 1985 season. This year at Riverside really turned into a race between Marty and me. We left everyone else quite a ways behind. If the finish line had been at a different location on the track, I would have won this race, no question. Thats the way it was in 1985.

[CoeShow]

Glamy,

I think it's great that you still have your 250R! When you mention, "Could it be the one" concerning the ATC500, it sounds as though you suspect it may be the original ATC500 that Marty rode. The answer is no. The trike you saw was a CR500 engine swap, no question. The factory ATC500 would not have to flip the seat up and out of the way to start it. It would have kicked forward like your 250R. You don't bore me! I hope you have other questions. Keep 'em coming.

[Billy Golightly]

Mike,

What do you see as probably one of the bigest areas of improvement that here we are even 20 years later still probably over looking on most machines? Suspension designs, weight bias forwards/backwards, lower center of gravity, more emphasis towards lighter weight, rotating mass reduction, etc?

[CoeShow]

Billy,

I don't really see anything that is being overlooked. Had the ATC stayed in production, I feel certain that evolutionary changes would have certainly been made in an effort to continually improve the product. It would have been the same as we see currently with the MX bikes. Until recently when Yamaha tilted the cylinder back, the changes to bikes have mainly been quite small overall, but improved none the less. 3 wheelers would have been the same. Especially if the other manufacturers were on board like with the quads.


Mike,

What do you see as probably one of the bigest areas of improvement that here we are even 20 years later still probably over looking on most machines? Suspension designs, weight bias forwards/backwards, lower center of gravity, more emphasis towards lighter weight, rotating mass reduction, etc?

[Billy Golightly]

Thats cool Mike. I just was curious. We are lucky to have a lot of very talented custom builders/fabricators and machinists here on the site. I love doing that type of stuff as well, and I think we all strive to try and keep improving and adding and making things better, trying to keep up with technology. Its fun to dream about the sort of changes the manufactures would have made with another 20 years. Would the trikes have been closer to 2 wheelers are as far as the level of evolution? Or quads which, arguably really haven't changed all THAT much. Certainly not as much as dirt bikes have.

[tundrawillie]

Mike, it's such an eye opener to hear about the politics involved, specifically back then, between Marty being the "golden boy" and at the same time, you being the superior rider fighting to win with inferior parts on your 250R's. As a kid, I imagined that all the Team ATC250Rs were mechanically identical. One thing I know...the magic of you guys in the old magazines will NEVER be topped by any sport or publications.

[CoeShow]

Billy,

Like you, I feel that the 3 wheelers would have evolved to a certain extent. How far, we can only guess. I also agree that the quads were never really developed at all after introduction. They stayed almost the same throughout their lifecycle. You can clearly see the difference in technological improvemnt on the 3 wheelers simply by comparing them from 1981-1986.
Huge difference! There was more development within these short years than any of the quads. There seemed to be some resurgence in factory involvement up until last year, with a few riders actually receiving quads, parts and even some financial support. Even with the recent support, it didn't come close to what we became used to making/winning at the races back in the eighties! It appears that ATV racing is once again "on it's own", and to be honest, I just don't think 4 wheel racing was ever as exciting as 3 wheels! I feel that spectators found more excitement watching 3 wheelers as well.

[CoeShow]

Tundrawillie,

I feel/felt as you do. There was a time when the riders were treated very similar with regards to support from Honda, but even during the early days of the ATC team, the riders developed and obtained sponsorship deals wth performance shops and whomever else might be willing to use ATC's for advertising such as apparel, goggle, boot, fuel, chain, helmet sponsors etc.

In 1985 we were FORCED to drop all of our sponsors. I knew that things were going to get ugly. Honda tried to force this same policy onto the MX racers as well, but it didn't fly over there. The "Hondaline" brand simply couldn't afford to offer the entire Honda MX team anywhere near the amount of endorsement money they had become accustomed to receive from outside sponsors. Plus, if the MX riders felt too pressured, they could always jump ship like Jeremy Mcrath and Ricky Carmichael did. After careful thought, Honda didn't push too hard in an effort to keep their riders.

Sadly for us on the ATC team, there were no other 3 wheel manufacturers to turn to looking for a ride. There was only Honda and Kawasaki, and Kawasaki was happy going to the races with Jimmy White solely as their primary rider and providing "support" for many others. So, you can see the dilemna we faced. It was Honda and Hondaline all the way or nothing.

At this time is also when Paul Turner somehow got his foot in the door at Team Honda ATC. In part, this may have been an effort to provide a team more in tune to your early thoughts of all the team ATC trikes being prepared exactly the same. I would have been fine with that. Sadly, Paul Turner and Steve Carter became interested in working with Marty only, and I was left out of all performance development.

I feel this is likely due to the fact that I felt Steve Carter didn't know as much about tuning as he would like people to believe. He was Danny "Magoo" Chandlers mechanic over at the MX team. When Danny got hurt, Steve wasn't needed. He found work with the ATC team initially to work on both Marty's AND my 3 wheelers.

After a number of what I consider "MAJOR" differences when it came to tuning and jetting, I basically told Steve, "Dude, you don't know trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro!" Steve could take a decently running trike (mine) and tune it to the point where it would begin fouling the plug! I would end up redoing all of his work and resumed tuning my trikes by myself. Steve was no dummy, he was simply what I considered a "Factory Parts Changer"

If something broke or needed changed, Steve had no problem witht that. If the engine needed to be gone through, Steve could handle that task as well. But when it came to porting, jetting, and knowledge of how to make a 2 stroke make more power, he was lost, at least at first. By the end of the 1986 season, after working side by side with Paul Turner for a couple of years, I believe he likely learned quite a bit.

Fortunately, Steve had a problem at one of the Mickey Thompsons races when he forgot to bolt something down on Marty's trike and the gas tank came off out on the track. Steve was so embarrased that he informed Wes McCoy at that very moment that he could only provide service to one rider only, and that he only wanted to wrench for Marty.

I said "fortunately" because when all was said and done, Chuck Miller was brought on board to be my mechanic. I thought things were looking up! Sadly, we soon learned how the testing was going to go down. Paul, Steve and Marty were to be the development team, and Chuck and I would inherit their "left-overs".

I can't tell you how slow some of the top-ends we HAD to use were! Paul Turner knew what he was doing. He could make fast stuff (the aftermarket Paul Turner components can tell you that) and did for Marty. Why I never received the same components is likely a direct result of Steve Carters and my earlier conflicts.

IMHO, Steve Carter was determined to teach me a lesson that you "Don't mess with the big dog" and he did everthing he could to make certain that all Chuck and I ever got was going to less than stellar power components and that Marty would have the best that Paul Turner could produce at the moment, which he did.

Anyways, Honda did try to emulate your thought of all of the trikes and riders being on equal ground. It may have "looked" like everything was equal from a spectator perspective, but in reality it was far from it.

I wish to comment that again, I didn't have anything against Marty, then or now. Marty was in the "cat birds seat" and I was fully aware of it. I tried unsuccesfully to persuade Wes McCoy to "please" let me use DG components. I even offered to have "Paul Turner" pre-ground into the side of the cylinders so everyone would think I was using Turner parts. No such luck. Wes also would never listen when I complained about Chuck and I receiving components (cylinders and pipes) that were down on power compared to what Marty was getting. At the faster race tracks where HP is needed (Riverside)this was clearly evident.

Looking back, I feel this was planned from the biggining of the 1985 season. Marty Hart was going to be the ATV 250 class National Champ, at any cost unless he got hurt. In this case I would win the championship for Honda. Either way Honda wins. My role was to be as "clean-up", to be on the podium for a Honda "sweep" to aid in advertising.

What Honda mangement didn't consider was that Mike Coe is somehow winning some races and Marty is struggling at times. What are they going to do?? Well, Honda changed the points structure. This stuff could never happen today, at least I hope not.

I now believe Wes knew that I was to get lesser components at the time. I was just too naive (and too young to know better) to think that Wes would want to support one of the ATC team members more than another. I mean, this was a TEAM right? I had learned a hard lesson. Before Marty, Wes McCoy was Dean Sundahls biggest fan. I knew this was the case early on, and let's face it, in 1981 Dean was the MAN. But I also felt that after I began winning some races and championships, that things would equal out and that Wes would begin to support me in an equal manner. It never worked out that way.

I have additional stuff to share about the "politics" concerning the Honda ATC race team. It was mostly good times, and overall, the good times clearly outweighed the bad, but there were still some things that were very hard to swallow.

.

[Patton ****]

Mike- I have to say, this is the best thread on any atv/atc site I have ever read !!! I was wondering if you could elaborate a little on your Yamaha deal, how many bikes you got, the level of support, how you liked the Banzee and Blaster, etc. I just started getting into racing the nationals around that time period and hooked up with a guy in PA who bought Don Turks Banzee's (The 88 white and blue one that Klemm did the motor work on, and the later Red and Black ones that Turner and Duncan did the work on). All I can say is they were wicked fast and after about 5-10 minutes of mx, you could not feel your arms and about half you fillings fell out (I was also 15 at the time, so maybe that had something to do with it). Any good stories about Don Turk and do you see him around at all now? Thanks again- and keep up the great posts. I saw you at the legends race in OH back in 2000, it seemed like to just got off the plane, but you still had great form and speed (even on 4 wheels).

[CoeShow]

Patton,

Thanks for the kind compliments. I was approached by Yamaha in late Sept. 1986. I had been racing my RM250 powered Suzuki with Brigg's built suspension to numerous wins and won a local Championship that was held at Carlsbad raceway, along with a number of CRC events sponsored by Suzuki back then.

Yamaha wanted to release their new Banshee to the public in 1987 with a significant major victory. They got ahold of Dean Sundahl and myself, along with Brett Driscoll, Ray Schooley and some others who's names escape me at the moment. These guy's were very talented SoCal riders. Yamaha wanted to debut and race the 1986 Baja 1000 in November. There was a shortage of Banshee's at that time. Dean had a pre-production version that he used for testing and evaluating. I didn't get one for some time later. We were quite impressed with the Quad, but also learned quickly that quite a bit of work needed to be done to get them Baja ready in such a short time.

Yamaha was up to the task! They hired Stuart Toomey to develop the engine for improved power. They already had Ohlins suspension working for the MX team and hired them to develop some outstanding shocks front and rear. The effort was nothing less than spectacular! There is much to say about that 1000 effort by Yamaha. It was stellar and Yamaha's finished 1-2. Even though Dean and I both crashed hard during the event, our co-riders picked-up the slack and carriedon for the 1-2 finish for Yamaha.

I informed Yamaha before I inked a deal forthe 1000, that I wasn't interested in a one race deal. I approached them with a realistic race plan to participate and compete in the AMA ATV nationals and Mickey Thompson short course stadium events. While the deal wasn't quite as lucrative as my past Honda deal, it was about the only thing going at the time. I got quads and just about anything I needed to race at these events. Somehow Mickey Thompson got some kind of advertising money from Yamaha to promote them at his races. Therewas some kind of mix-up because when all was said and done, the quad class was to e a 250cc only class. I believe initially, there was goingto be a 250 and open class at Mickeys.

A short time after the 1987 season started, Yamaha sent all of the ATV racing effort over to a start-up race and suspension shop named "Noleen Racing" It was owned and operated by a former Yamaha guy, Clark Jones. Clark was brother-in-law to former multi Nartional MX Champ Gary Jones. He became my team manager.

Since the open class quad class was thrown out, Clark knew we needed to build a 250cc Banshee. There was some thought and testing on a 250cc twin. While this was fairly easy to do, the quad was nearly unridable due to it's ultra hi and narrow RPM powerband. I rode this quad. While it had big HP, it also had 0 low RPM torque. It had a YZ60 powerband. Omce it came on the pipes, you couldn't hold on to it, and then once you got it corrected it was bogging again. No good.

I offered my brothers expertise to build a Banshee with a 250cc MX engine. Clark agreed and gave me anything I needed to complete the task. we quickly learned that Mickey's rules also stated that the engine must be ATV based. That was OK because we ended up using Tri-Z engines which were nealy identical to the YZ power plants ofthat era. While my brother built an awesome machine, none of my sponsors were too hip to help develop this one-off machine.

Understandably, there would be 0 aftermarket sales for a 250cc single powered Banshee! So, the initial power was down a bit and results were not that good. I always had top 10 finishes, but knew I could do better with more power. I spent too much time going back and forth between trying to remain competitive in the open National class with a true 350cc Banshee, (I had some wins at the nationals racing against Suzuki 500 "Quadzilla's and other Banshees) and building and trying to make a competitive Thompson racer. Enter Don Turk.

Don was racing a Suzuki with some success. I am not sure of all the particulars, but he was soon racing Yamaha's. Clark had my brother fabricate another 250 Banshee for Don and we were racing at Mickeys. At the Nnationals, Don would race in the 250 class and I would race in the open class. We drove together to a couple of races on the circuit in my Dodge van hauling both of our machines.

Later in the season Don traveled with other privateers and I traveled again with my brother Sam as my mechanic. I dont recall if Don had another chassis built by Duncan, or if he continued to use the one my brother built. I believe he may have totaled his original quad in a crash. I know that my 250 YZ powered Banshee buzzed only a small amount. No worse than a Kawasaki or Tri-Z, so I can only presume he had another quad built by somebody else if it indeed vibrated as badly as you remember, or maybe it had some cracks in the frame or motor mounts when you rode it. I never felt my 250c racer was as fast as it needed to be to be truly competitve. My 350cc Banshee National Banshee was another story! That was one of, if not the fastest 350's of that era. I was VERY competitve and won a number of races on that machine prepared by my brother Sam using DG Performance equipment.

I haven't seen Don Turk since the 1988 season, which was my last as a Professional. At that time I believe I was the only fully sponsored ATV racer in America.

When I raced that Honda back in Ohio in 2000, that was the first time I ever rode a Honda Fourtrax. I hadn't even ridden an ATV of any sort since 1993! I hope this sheds some light on your questions. If you have others, ask away.

[falloutboy]

First off, it's great to have someone like you on the board!

Also, I found a set of videos on youtube of the San Jose 1985, 250cc class 3-wheeler race. Maybe they were brought up already, I just don't have the patience to read all 29 pages.

I heard your name a few times, maybe you could point out which one you were, perhaps a play by play or something :D....
Part 1:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5hpqAcm6es
part 2:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKPPX9lJIOQ&NR=1
part 3:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nDx4fE7yvNk&NR=1

[ScAwN7]

Glad to see you're still around Mike. I won't comment on your story other than to say, it doesn't change the fact that I always looked up to every rider at Team Honda. You, Marty Hart, Steve Wright, Curtis Sparks, and Rodney Gentry were my idols. I also share your love for the 1986 ATC250R. Here are a couple of pictures of me racing when I was 15 years old. A short list of mods were the Honda short track tank, engine bored .40 over, Hoosier quad front tire, Burris go-kart tires on the rear, and the highest gearing we could get. I want to say it was 19/30, but whatever it was, the chain notched the case of the engine and it rode on the rear sprocket carrier until it finally wore a grove. This was our local 1/8 mile oval in Ada, OH.

http://lithin.com/scawn/Images/ATC250R_002.JPEGhttp://lithin.com/scawn/Images/ATC250R_003.JPEG

[CoeShow]

Falloutboy,
I have watched those a few times and can't quite make out much except that Marty Hart finally got by Eddie Sanders for the lead and basically was unchallenged for the rest of the race. I see myself and Jimmy White at times. It also appears as though Jimmy breaks and I may have ended up in third place. Other than that, I can't really elaborate much other than I was VERY lucky to have finished that well with all that happened that weekend!

I give Doug Richards (Race promotor) credit for having long races. Even though the flat track races were easier physically, you still had to be in good shape to go 20 or 25 laps in one of these fast races. While San Jose was a decent track, there were in my opinion still too many hairpin style turns that make for more of a single file racing line that made passing more difficult. I liked simple ovals and Grand National TT Motorcycle type race tracks better. I ALWAYS wanted to race at the Peoria TT race track on my 3 wheeler! I really admired the BIG jump there.

[CoeShow]

Scawn7,

I like your duds. Looks just like the Team Honda stuff! Did you really like those little tires? Nice photos. I bet they bring back fond memories. Honda did try to employ the best talent at any given time.

[ScAwN7]

There was a guy from Columbus, OH named Mark Goodflesch (spelling?) who came to our local track on a 1985 Tecate with the go-kart tires and he proceeded to smoke everyone. So of course, that was the new thing to try. I personally felt it was the CR250 piston he was running in his Kawi motor, but whatever, LOL. Almost every 250cc 3 wheeler was running go-kart tires by the end of that season due to the lower cost and increased stability. Even a few 250cc quads switched over but they were sandwiching the rear hubs with a tire on each side for a total of 4 go-kart tires in the rear. I remember when 3&4 Wheel Action covered the big race in Ashtabula, OH they had pics of a guy using them on a quad, so I guess the idea spread.

Yea, the pics definitely bring back memories. I've actually started looking for an 86-87 TRX250R to purchase, just to ride for fun. I would prefer another 86 ATC250R, but unless I could find one with a short track tank, it just wouldn't be the same.

[quebecbroil]

hi Mr Coe
its great to read from someone who was there when 3wheeler was present as i was born in 82. i wonder if you ever saw or heard if suzuki had a racing trike or prototype back then.

[Eric250R]

Mike, I"m sure I"m not going to add anything to this thread that hasn't already been said, and I'm going to more or less share the same feeling that I did in Driscoll's thread. I grew up idolizing you guys. And have recently became friends with alot of my idols on facebook ( Sundahl, Donnie Banks, Jimmy White, Chris Berry, and Jackie Meadows ) gotta love the internet. I just read your entire thread again and it amazes me the behind the scenes stuff that went on. Love hearing these stories. Jimmy White often talks about the things Honda did back in the day to put things a little more in there favor, and you can tell it's left a bad taste in his mouth even all these years later. He also went on to talk about the way Honda was treating their quad teams up until recently, and the very little effort they put forth into them......how things change....or don't. I also agree with you that the 4 wheelers never and will never have the feeling of 3 wheeler racing back in the golden age. It's awesome we all have some place to come together and meet our heros from back then..... pleasure to chat with you. Once again, congrats on the grandchild.

[CoeShow]

Quebecbroil,
My first wife's father owned and operated a Suzuki motorcycle deaership back in the late seventies and early eighties. I was able to attend one of the dealer meetings they had back then that provided some early data. It apperaed that Suzuki was very close and possibly in the process of entering a performance 3 wheeler to market. Things changed quickly however and Suzuki may have dodged a huge bullet by NOT bringing a performance 3 Wheeler to the public, but instead released the Quadrunner 4 wheelers instead. Anyways, I do believe there WERE some prototype 3 wheelers from Suzuki, but nothing more.

[CoeShow]

Eric250R,

Even though all that stuff happed a long time ago, it doesn't seem like that many years have gone by. All of my racing endeavors are still very fresh in my mind. I still remember most ALL of my races, from as way back as my BMX days. There was certainly a lot of politics involved during the 1985 season, at least over at the Honda ATC team! So, Sundahl's on Facebook? How's he doing? I haven't seen or talked with him in many years. The last time was when I saw him in the desert with his very young daughter. She must be close to 20 years old by now.

[quebecbroil]

thanks for the reply
im very curious how this prototype (if it ever existed) looked like, maybe ill try to ask suzuki if we can have pics of this, i read also something Dean Kirsten posted on this site, he said that someday he was at the dune for riding he saw a van or closed trailer and it was suzuki crew testing a trike and when they reconized the 3wheeler magazine crew they packed the trike quickly and leaved immidiatly, so i do beleive they was close to come up with something

[GREGMCKEE]

Hey Mike....
Great to read all the responses on here...cant believe its a 5 year old thread!!
Loved reading about all the Team Honda stories, seeing all the pix (particularly the 1984 ATC250R watercooled works bike with the low rad shrouds and the wild tread patterned Ohtsu flat track tires..if anyone has more pix of those bikes please post them!!) Reading this thread it seems to me like the year 1985 was really a turning point in Honda's racing history, both in ATV's and MX as well. 1985 was the end of the real trick works stuff (ATC200R, and the MX RC series) It was the end of individuality of the racer as far as your aftermarket connections with DG and apparel companies (the whole Hondaline thing) and the last real stand for Team Honda ATC as the championship powerhouse and magnet for racing talent. and then the two words that made me queasy "Suzuki Quadracer"...I can still remember thinking that machine would change everything. Mike, did you see the changes coming ahead of time? And one thing I always wondered from my side of the pages of the ATV magazines I read...how much did a factory ATV racer make? I apologize if this has been touched on already...Thanks for all the replies Mike, its really cool to be able to read about and talk to one of the guys I really looked up to in my teen years!

Greg

[CoeShow]

Greg,

While I did know changes were on the horizon, I never thought the changes would be so severe that 3 wheelers would be "outlawed". I have no idea what other racers of my era earned. I also don't wish to state actual numbers, but I will state that I earned well into 6 digits for the 1985 season. I made good money in 1984, but 85 was my best year financially. Before 1984, the earnings weren't as high, but I was still making more than I had ever earned in my life previously by a good margin. I was very fortunate to be a member of the Honda Big Red Machine, no question.

[jrush]

112062This is the coolest thread of all time! Havn't been able to read the entire thing yet but will soon. I've got a couple questions for Mike. Sorry if this has already been answered but have you ever thought about writing a book about your racing career? That would be great. And this isn't a 3 wheel related question but I may never get another chance to ask. What ever happened to the Yamaha Blaster you raced? I have the May 1988 3 & 4 Wheel Action with the test on it with the YFM60 nosepiece and all. One of the trickest looking quads of all time.

[CoeShow]

jrush,

I was only able to race that machine a few times before Yamaha decided to pull the plug and stop providing ATV racing support at the end of the 1988 season. It was a shame because Yamaha REALLY pushed to see the Blaster on the track at Mickey Thompson events. I sold the quad to a young up and coming racer who lived and raced in the Oklahoma City area. I don't recall ever hearing from them or seeing the quad in any other magazine stories or race results.

The quad ended up turning out quite well. It handled great and needed only a bit more engine development before becoming equally competitive with the Honda's and Suzuki's. It was perfect for Mickey Thompson events with it's truck like looks! That was all my brothers idea. Even Ivan Stewart thought is was cool looking. I have no idea where it might be today.

[jrush]

jrush,

I was only able to race that machine a few times before Yamaha decided to pull the plug and stop providing ATV racing support at the end of the 1988 season. It was a shame because Yamaha REALLY pushed to see the Blaster on the track at Mickey Thompson events. I sold the quad to a young up and coming racer who lived and raced in the Oklahoma City area. I don't recall ever hearing from them or seeing the quad in any other magazine stories or race results.

The quad ended up turning out quite well. It handled great and needed only a bit more engine development before becoming equally competitive with the Honda's and Suzuki's. It was perfect for Mickey Thompson events with it's truck like looks! That was all my brothers idea. Even Ivan Stewart thought is was cool looking. I have no idea where it might be today.

Thank you so much Mike. Truly a unique quad.

[wheelz420]

awsome reading man , id love to race these thing but ive got the no suspenion 185s from 83 , fun to plow with though.

[CoeShow]

wheelz420,

Us "old school" 3 wheeler racers ALL started on non-suspended trikes! We raced the heck out them and each other for many years with 0 suspension. It was a LOT of fun!

[Twilight]

wheelz420,

Us "old school" 3 wheeler racers ALL started on non-suspended trikes! We raced the heck out them and each other for many years with 0 suspension. It was a LOT of fun!

Just more proof us kids nowadays are wusses. =) hahaha

[wheelz420]

i didnt know they raced em , its fun drifting in the snow ill have to give it a shot when i go to mounds orv park here in michigan , i havent really got a chance to get it outta the back yard other then plowing , donuts with a huge plow is really fun though

[wheelz420]

sweet vids Pro Three Wheeler 250CC Class - San Jose 1985 - Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5hpqAcm6es
Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKPPX9lJIOQ part 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nDx4fE7yvNk

[wheelz420]

i think you took 3rd in that one. what number were you ? crazy racin man

[wheelz420]

cool rider proile from 82 http://airfoolers.com/?page_id=724

[CoeShow]

wheelz420,

If you are referring to the San Jose race, I believe I did somehow manage a distant third place finish in that race. You can read about the entire race and pre-race issues in a story I posted earlier in this thread. You already have a great starting point with your 185s for great fun. Those wheelers are fitted with a bit of suspension that will smooth out alot of the rough stuff.
The biggest thing to remember is to simply have fun! Having the biggest and baddest isn't required to have fun.
Merry Christmas.

[Bryan Raffa]

how may Video's or movies did Honda produce.. like the sanJose vid and 3 wheels and a cloud of dust.. is there more?????? Man I hope there's more! ,,,,,I'm anxiously waiting to see the whole 3 wheelers and a cloud of dust video Tommie G .. gave mymint here on the boards!:Bounce:Bounce

[CoeShow]

Bryan,

Did you see the Santa Cruz National video thats now on YouTube and here on the site? Anyone with a copy of 3 wheels and a cloud of dust should post it up as well (full version) 3 wheels and a cloud of dust is great viewing also! I don't have a copy of it. If I did, it would be posted here for all to see as well.

[Bretmd94]

Bryan,

Did you see the Santa Cruz National video thats now on YouTube and here on the site? Anyone with a copy of 3 wheels and a cloud of dust should post it up as well (full version) 3 wheels and a cloud of dust is great veiwing as well! I don't have a copy of it. If I did, it would be posted here for all to see as well.

Someone has to have these old 3 wheeler videos. It would be nice to have a section of the forums purely for video links. The Trikesylvania page moves so quickly that the great videos that have been posted get pushed back within a few days. I know I like watching through them about every 6 months, from the 80's vids to the new great videos being made by members.

It would be a nice area to locate old videos and get them transfered online, I know that would be a hit with this crowd.

[Keith Salyer]

I have vhs copies of Miami and Porterfield. I may have more but will take some looking.
Bryan,

Did you see the Santa Cruz National video thats now on YouTube and here on the site? Anyone with a copy of 3 wheels and a cloud of dust should post it up as well (full version) 3 wheels and a cloud of dust is great veiwing as well! I don't have a copy of it. If I did, it would be posted here for all to see as well.

[shortline10]

I would love to see the copy of the 1985 Miami Grand National race . I raced the 200cc class in that event .




I have vhs copies of Miami and Porterfield. I may have more but will take some looking.

[Billy Golightly]

Mike has been gracious enough to share his personal riding/racing picture collection with me. I'm in the process of going over it and uploading the pictures to the site to make an article, I've got probably close to 40 that are just awesome, so stay tuned to see that stuff here on the site too!

[Keith Salyer]

How do I go about getting some racing footage downloaded to the site. The tapes have some interviews of the Coe Show from his younger days.

[Bryan Raffa]

oh man I can hardly wait!!!!!!!! the person who has 3 wheeles and a cloud of dust ,, is holding on to it till the Invasion ride in the dunes the first part of march.. the people that show up to that ride ..will be the first to see it in some time ..personally I have never seen it ,, but a teaser that he gave up...is totally bodacious...(probley havent hear that in a wile) LOL this came from Tom Gaian who will be attending...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEMv3uDzP2Q

[CoeShow]

I spoke to Tommy during the Holidays. I am working on him to get on line here and over at AirFoolers to share his video and to share his wealth of knowledge on racing and 3 wheelers in general. His son is a multi-time National(and World?) BMX champ, so he has passed on some winning genes.

[mthurman23]

Hey mike
i started racing atc's in 85 and copied your number because i liked your style of racing. From then i raced quads and then dirt stock cars all the time keeping the number 23. Now in my 40's i ride motorcycles and atv's and i still have the number 23 on at least one at all times. Thanks for the use of the number.lol
mark thurman
thurman offroad development

[TurboTacoma]

Mike:

I have read every posting that you have wrote about your ATC'n racing life and politics! All I can say is "WOW" and "Awesome" like the others here who wrote before me! It is great to read about the experiences you went through and how you managed to work through the "B.S." that had worked against you, as you tried to maintain your winning status as a ATC racer. And I find it even "cooler" that you have taken time from your life to post and answer questions of all the members here! I appreciate your honesty and your own feelings about the events and the people you had to deal with along the way. I want to say thank you for the entertaining thread and the understanding of your experiences as a fellow racer, ATC enthusiast, and a former national star!


I will be watching this thread with Great interest!:beer
Tim

[CoeShow]

Mark,

I'm happy you like the number 23 as well. I started using it because it was my birthday number.

[CoeShow]

Tim,

Thanks for your kind words. Keep the questions coming! Tell everybody to ask away.

[Chazz of Blades]

I am 16, and have been into trikes for about a year and a half now. So far I have been prepping to start racing next season locally, much to the amusement of the other racers(all bikes and quads as usual). I am determined to race, but sometimes I just start feeling down because of all the harsh words and attitudes. But after reading through your, and all the other legends, posts time and time again, it has reinforced my resolve to race. I just feel it in my blood, I HAVE to race. It's wierd, ya know?

[CoeShow]

Chazz of Blades,

back in my racing days, three wheelers were BANNED from racing and quads were the only ATV's that race promoters were allowed to sanction races for due to numerous reasons. If you have a facilty and promoter that sanctions and allows 3 wheelers to race and you have your mind set on it, go for it! Good luck and ride safely. I noticed you have quite a collection of vehicles. That number of cars and ATV's is quite impressive for a 16 year old. Nice.

[Chazz of Blades]

Thanks, I do alot of buisness buying and trading. And I can race at almost all the small local tracks around here, just not in the larger cities. It's finding a bit of sponsorship thats killing me.

[CoeShow]

I understand there is a group in Ohio that puts on 3 wheeler races. I know it's a long way from Alabama, but it's good to hear there are other areas allowing 3 wheelers to compete. I guess it would depend on number of entries as well. No sense in having a race with only a couple entries.

[Chazz of Blades]

Hahaha, I wish it was dedicated. I'd be racing quads of the same size. Think a bit more "local".

[Chazz of Blades]

And it's not much more than groups of people racing at a small dirt track for cash prizes. No standings, or finals, really small scale, but normaly with a good bit of racers at once.

[CoeShow]

It's good that you get to race. I never liked the idea of racing 3 and 4 wheelers together.

[BWard]

Me Either, Did it quite a few times though.

[Chazz of Blades]

Gotta start somewhere eh?

[Bryan Raffa]

Mike ,, I was absoutly blown away meeting you guys this week,, thanks for the picture and signing my helmet!

From me and the rest of us,, thanks for comeing out...:D

Tell your brother thanks also!

[CoeShow]

Bryan,

This is for everybody out there. It was OUR pleasure! Hopefully we can join you folks next year with some wheelers. I'd really like to see some of the photos and possible video from the Gordons Well INVASION . Take care. I'll be reading.

[Jason Hall]

Mike- I would like to thank you also. You and your Brother are full of knowledge, I soaked In everything I could LOL. Thanks for signing my fenders on my Aluminum 450r. I was amazed when you guys rolled Into the Invasion!!! See you next time!!

[atctim]

Mike -

Between you and Tommy - it was a real blast hanging out with you guys for an afternoon. You guys are the LEGENDS in our sport adn it was awesome meeting you! Thanks for the signatures and thanks for the great stories of yesteryear!

Here is some pics and videoas from the Invasion:

http://www.3wheelerworld.com/showthread.php?126948-2011-Imperial-Invasion-Photo-and-video-thread!!&highlight=imperial+invasion

[Blizzard420]

Mike
Was wondering if you could give some detailed info on the 480 your brother built for you? What kind of setup did you have,other then the 83 front end? How long was the rear swinger, and what was the pipe fabricated from?
Thx

[dcreel]

:-)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160561905054&viewitem=&sspagename=ADME%3AB%3AWNA%3AUS%3A1123

http://i.ebayimg.com/02/!CC82WFg!2k~$(KGrHqEOKpoE0UegnOKhBNM5uGhbd!~~_12.J PG

[CoeShow]

We had a VERY good time out with you guys and gals at the INVASION!

As far as the 480, I believe the swing arm was 3 inches over stock length. The pipe was a custom made pipe from steel sheet metal hand rolled cones, as any custom cone pipe. There was nothing really exotic or special that wasn't readily available for the 250's other than the front end. It was a very clean and functional conversion with emphasis on strong motor and pipe mounts. The engine was stock.

[justin4]

I just read the whole thing . Great read. Hopr to go to the invation next year . Keep it coming Mike . Hey did you ever race in ua place in upstate new york called broom tioga raceway? Unnadilla a nother thriller in unnadilla was what the radio would say for weeks jeff ward ronleichine (spelling?). Just wondering?

[CoeShow]

justin4,

Whike I did race a number of times in NewYork, I don't recall ever racing at Broome or Unadilla. Most of the racing we did back there was Ice Racing on Lake George and a NY State Championship ice race. We did have a National back there that got rained on VERY heavily and Honda got embarrased significantly because we didn't have any tires for the conditions. Most everyone else had Hoosiers designed for the wet conditions.

[justin4]

Thanks for the answer . Keep up the posting I know you get very busy thank you for taking the time . I also got the grand pa notice . Good luck with life. Justin .

[CoeShow]

Things are very busy with my work and internet business for CRF150's and 230's. I went out earlier this month to see the grandson. Had a great time visiting with my girls. Wish I could have stayed longer! So I'm ready to answer any and all questions, within reason. Ask away!

[shawnroy1971]

Alway's great to hear from you racer's,thank's for sharing the stories and picture's.Any chance of restoring a 250r?..Driscoll is starting on a tri-z...Maybe we could see you guy's lineup one more time.

[CoeShow]

shawnroy,
Im keeping my eyes open for an 85 or 86 250R. Just have to wait and see... Those TPC trikes are real nice too!

[bkm]

1983 CoeShow is schooling the field.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZ0PuvGfSws

This is a pretty cool video!

[gli_ryan]

This thread is simply amazing. I haven't gotten past page 11 yet, but I wonder if any of the guys that attempted to foil your (Mike Coe's) last season have seen this and what their reactions are/would be.

[JumpinJR66]

Mike,
One NY race you refer to was held at the Little Valley fairgrounds in NY. It rained heavy that weekend, and the racing got messy to say the least. Riders were not allowed to ride their bikes in the pits for some reason and were required to push them to the stagging areas.

From what I recall, the 200 or 250 two stroke classes frustrated Rodney Gentry, but Curtis Sparks mopped up in the 200x class per usual. Gentry ran as a priviteer, and fell off the pace that weekend. We pitted with he and his Dad, but later that year he won over Honda and a full factory ride.

The 250's ran pretty a tight exciting race with a series of doubles on the back stretch that were absolutely incredible to see you pross sail over within inches of won another. The nerve and skill you had was really amazing to watch (even for a nine or ten year old such as myself)

One of my Dad's fondest memories of racing was saying you a couple of Honda riders pointed to my Modified 70 as I raced by exclaiming how cool it was. It was, being blue, with a white tank, and new 85 red, white, and blue Honda wing stickers on the tank. My Dad and I built the bike from scratch and it was trick!

I also recall the GN Ice Race at Lake George. I think you and Curtis Sparks were doing some handout promotion for free french fries at McDonalds. Curtis kept referring to them as "hot grease sticks" in a real smart ass manner. "Hey, come get your free hot grease sticks." My Dad loved it, and we have joked ever since about "grease sticks." The ice racing in the Northeast was quite a ride for a little kid like me, and seeing the pros from Cali (Team Honda and Team Grean) pitting on the ice and running with the locals was really cool. Heck, sheet metal screws were in every tire, and the Honda team mechanics were asking the locals how to best stud up the tires for bite and controll.

Great memories!! I hope this jogged some memories.

Thanks for all the posts.

[CoeShow]

JumpinJR66,

I remember that race well. I was forced to use Ohtsu tires for the 1985 season, as were all Team Honda members. While the Ohtsu reps worked exceedingly hard to design a short course racing tire, they had nothing to really compete with the existing Hoosier tires available to anyone. Ohtsu had nothing for the wet conditions for that event and we didn't fare too well in the main events that were quite sloppy. The Hoosier wet tire worked admirably as always. I can inform you that most of the races I DIDNT win that year were due to poor traction of the Ohtsu rear tires. Had we been able to use Hoosier tires, Team Honda may have won every race. Thanks for writing!!

[Addicted]

wow. this thread is amazing! keep the questions up boys...

[Davin]

LOL - Steve Wright didn't quite have the talent......CLASSIC the older I get the faster I was.
He sure had a lot of wins.

[CoeShow]

Davin,

The comment I made concerning Steve Wright not having quite the talent was directed at his involvement in the 250cc Pro class. He did race it a few times, but like Tom Gaian, felt more comfortable racing in the 125-200cc classes. During the 1986 season, When Stevie raced the 250cc FourTrax, he had a much harder time competing with the top talent in that class.

Both Tommy, Stevie and ALL of the Team Honda riders were/are very talented riders/racers, no question.

[Darius1502]

Hi Mike,

Its great to see you on here and of course get to share how much we all enjoyed the memories you gave us back in the day. Thank you!

Here is a picture of you and Dean from the DG website:

Isn't that Tom Gaian on the 250R?

133828

[CoeShow]

Yes, that is Tom Gaian. I forgot all about that photo shoot. Thanks for posting it up!

[motoman1012002]

So coe you goin to make it and race at the 3 wheeler race at ashtabula pinelake this year in july

[CoeShow]

Motoman,
I was aware that 3 wheelers were going to have a class at this years Ashtabula race. While I would have liked to have attended as a spectator, there were conflicting items on my calendar. I was happy to learn that Jackie Meadows attended and won convincingly in the pro race! Jackie was too young to have moved up into the 250 and open classes when three wheeler racing ended. He was one of, if not the fastest youth racers at any event he attended and I'm happy that I got to know him and his father, Jack Sr. Well done Jackie!! I know your dad (RIP) and mom were thrilled! You did it brother. Bill from TPC trikes was gracious in sending me a DVD copy of this years event. Thanks Bill, and thank you Motoman for inquiring. Sorry it took so long for me to reply.

[Joseph Farrow]

WOW. Awesome tread. Just read from start to finsh. (took me a couple of days...)

Mike appreciate you taking your time to come on here and give us your view from back in the day. '85 was definitely the High Point in 3 Wheeler racing. It was the Biggest I can remember. There were a lot of very talented 3 Wheeler racers that just quit when the Quads came on the scene.

I have a question for you concerning your early days on the 90. In the SoCal racing scene who was the fastest on the hard tails and who built the fastest/best engines during that time?

My family made the trip out West in '83 to come to the Santa Cruz Off Road National. It was the first real National event I ever attended. Got to meet all of the top racers. You won the 250 class and you won the Open class but ran off the track and did not re-enter at the same place so they bumped you to 5th.

I have some race shots but they pretty much suck since they were taken with a 110 camera.

I do have one of you holding down a rear tire. LOL

173651

Not sure if you are on here anymore but I do appreciate your contributions to the sport and this forum.

[Jrash77]

Mike- Welcome to the board brother!

Jamie

[Outlaw #24]

Mike I just finished reading this entire thread and realized you haven't been on here in over a year. I have a question, Do you remember the national Mx in Des Moines, Iowa at the State Fair grounds? And If you do, can you recall the situation that the team had as far as incorporating the first water cooled units being retrofitted into the 200x frames? How did you finish at that race? Also do you remember Rodger Berman and Mike Elsberry? We would All like to see you come to Trike Fest in June!

[phantomtracer]

Mike,
In an interview that Dean Sundahl did for "3 & 4 Wheel Action" June 1985 he sounded really upset with Honda and says there was a teammate that basically got him thrown off the team. Do you recall this,? what happened and who was he referring to?
Great stories.

[thcowboy]

Mike hasnt been on since 2012 :(:cry:

[phantomtracer]

I just read the December 1985 Dirt Wheels, they have a much different account of the events. They state that Marty Hart cut the course a bit after Luce got stuck.
Do you know for a fact that team Honda drove him to a spot on the course and dropped him off?
After all, you were racing at the time, how could you know?
Don't get me wrong, I love the stories.
It just seems so hard to believe.




Hey every one! I'll try to shed SOME of the crap that happened in 1985 and answer some other questions. I warn that this may get long.........

Curtis,

Harry Klemm worked with me individually(in secret) and we tested some very good stuff. At the time Honda had sent over a number of specially designed WORKS HIPO cylinders that would bolt on and were ALMOST indistinguishable from the stockers. While Harry's stuff was excellent, using everything of his on top of one of the WORKS cylinders made even better power. Bill's helped me big time with the 3 wheelers and then more when I was running some one-off quads for Yamaha.

The late Mickey Thompson was quite a salesman! He talked Yamaha into sponsoring into his Off-Road Gran Prix, and then came back and said,"Oh by the way, displacement limits for the quad racers is 250cc!! Yamaha was anticipating being able to race Banshees! No luck. Instead, My brother modified the Banshee frames to accept YZ250 engines. He built 2 for myself and another for Don Turk who raced with some success for a few years.

Nobody in their right mind wanted to spend any time working on something that they couldn't turn around and market for sale. Bill's still came to my rescue and made some Excellent hand built pipes for my YZ powered Banshees and for the one off Blaster I raced at a few races too. Unfortunately The Yamaha's were never as competitive as I would have liked because they were so different and every thing was unique to them.

For the last National of the year at San Jose in 1985, Chuck gathered together all of the parts for us to test and come up with a combo that we liked best. The testing session was held at Corona Raceway and was just incredible. While typical testing sessions were sometimes like splitting hairs to tell a difference, this day everything we tried kept making the trike faster and faster and faster.

When we left the raceway, I was ecstatic at how the trike was running. I KNEW I would be at the front at San Jose NO question. I had just come off of back to back victories at the last two Nationals and was in top form as well.

The cylinder that we chose for this race was a VERY custom reworked cylinder. The transfer ports were all epoxied up and recontoured and were VISIBLY modified. There was a boat load of work done to this cylinder. Chuck Miller my mechanic (and now current Honda Race Team Manager!) was convinced that the trike was clearly the best we had (using Turner components) for the season. The stopwatch doesn't lie. Somehow Steve Carter(Marty's mechanic) and Paul Turner felt that this cylinder was no good as it had clearly been run by them prior to making into our "pile" of leftovers for us to test.

Well, San Jose comes and we go out and set fast time in practice and Marty is struggling. I had absolutley no issue's other than some slight jetting changes that just made my trike even faster. We were looking forward to wining three in a row!

Chuck and I went to Sizzler that evening for dinner. Afterwards we went back to our hotel and were ready to call it a day. We were in my rental car when we came back to the Hotel and when we got there our Honda Box Van was GONE!!

We both went into a slight panic and Chuck started making frantic calls before calling the Police and reporting it stolen. Just about this time, Wes McCoy, the team manager got ahold of Chuck and informed him that the van wasn't stolen.
We both felt a huge relief, but then we asked, "Were is our van then?"

We were informed that Marty was unhappy with how his trike was running, and that his mechanic just wanted to "measure out" my top-end to possibly make a duplicate for Marty to try early the next day. I didn't like the sound of how things were going..... Not the night before the last NAtional of the year!! Wes said "Don't worry, everything will be fine" "Just go and get a good night rest". I did not like it.

Chuck and I drove over to where Paul Turner had a friend with a shop there in San Jose. Nobody expected us to show up there. We parked about a block away and walked up to the open doors of this shop. Heres Wes, Steve, and Paul Turner all thrashing about and there's MY 3 WHEELER all torn apart!! I was LIVID! I started yelling at them asking WTF were they doing!! They just kept saying that they wanted to "copy" it so that Marty might be more competitive. Then Steve gets in my face saying I should be more of a team player and other crap like that. I had been getting royally screwed over for the entire year using the crap Paul Turner/ left over parts. I had it up to here with his and Steve Carter's BS. I let it fly.

Well, I drive to the race track the following morning and Chuck can't even look me in the eye and looks as if he is really digusted. I get my riding gear on and when I look my trike over it's got a completly different topend on it!! I couldn't F**** believe it!! Chuck assembled my trike with a brand new top end, with no time on it. It promptly stuck in the first practice session. MY heat race just happened to be the first one of the morning. Chuck thrashed like a madman to put on another top end. In his rush, he assembled the engine with another cylinder that had been bored first over, and without realizing it, he put it together with a standard size piston. When I kicked it over it did start, but you can imagine what it sounded like. They promptly called my race to the start and I don't really remember where I finished. Its amazing the thing ran at all By now I'm on fire!

In between races I worked my way over to Marty's area. (we were supposed to be a team, but Steve and Marty always parked away form the rest of Team Honda) Anyway, they see me coming and Wes and Steve rush over to keep me away. Nothing could, and I got close enough to see it. There it was in all its Glory!! Martys trike had MY TOP END AND PIPE mounted. I was stunned to say the least!

I was so frustrated with all the turn of events I just couldn't help it and I lost it. I was between tears and yelling for what seemed like minutes. The wind had completly left my sails thats for sure. All I could think of was how political this season had become, and how it wasn't any fun anymore, and how much of a TEAM it wasn't.

I can't remember my finish at that race (anybody know?) By the main Chuck had a decent combo bolted up, but I had like the last pick of the back row to start in the main.

My finish still would have made me the points champion anyway, but Honda changed the points AGAIN to somehow allow Marty to collect a bogus championship. Even the Kawasaki guys knew it was all rigged. I did come away with a big pay check for the season, some consolation, but I still know I was the 1985 250 class champion.

It still gripes me to this day. Can you tell ?

Another story?? This is where it really got going and cooking. OK

At the Loretta Lynn's National earlier that year(85) It was a two race deal. The first day was the motocross race which I won. I went 2-1 to Marty's 1-2, giving me the win. The next day was the woods race. I don't know how many of you out there ever ran one of the early woods races, but let me tell you, the start is KEY. After you enter the woods it is single file, no exceptions. There are very few places to pass if you can, but not many.

Donny Luce gets the holeshot and is riding very well. I think I'm in 4th or 5th and making good time. It is a long race. 3 hours or something. Guess what? These races are dead engine start. When the flag drops, you have to kick over your machine and go! Unknown to me at the start, Marty's trike fouls the plug and does NOT START! By the time his mechanic figures out he has a fouled plug its 5+ minutes later.

Well, they get this BIG Idea thinking NO one will know. They throw Marty's trike in his box van and take it down the road some miles to where the course comes out near the road. They unload, throw in a new plug, and they wait until they can hear racers approaching. Then Marty takes off..... IN THE LEAD! Since it is such a long race you have to pit for fuel and goggles and stuff. Donny held the lead from the start, and I was being filled in during the pit stops of my positions and of the mounting fiasco with Marty and the race. It was clear that some serious stuff was going to hit the fan.

Marty stayed in front and Donny was credited for second place and I was third I believe at the finish. Kawasaki had watched the stuff with Marty unfold and they protested.

The Promoter (Dave Coombs) was a very honorable guy, but Honda had such an influence on these promotors that he said he couldn't act appropriately. He said that Marty SHOULD be DQ'd, and that Donny should be the victor, and me second.

After hours of behind the scene gesturing, they finally came out with the results. Donny first, MARTY SECOND and me third. Still totally bogus!!! I actually pulled in to the Kawasaki pits after the race because I was so mad at what was happening!

Chuck informed me that if Marty didn't get at least 2nd place, he would have no shot at the points title. (too bad)

I still went out and won the Baja 1000 as my final race effort for Honda in November. My fourth BAJA 1000 victory in as many years. As a consolation, The Honda "A" team (Marty, Wax, Curtis Sparks) for the 1000 had what was supposed to be the fastest off road 250R of all time. Turner and Carter spent untold amount of time and effort building this missle that was supposed to spank everything and set a land speed record. My team, consisting of Tracy Dickson, Steve Wright and myself (B Team) had a few Turner components and we went testing right threre in Baja. We quickly learned that our stock pre-runners were faster than our Turner "prepped" race trike! We started swapping on stock OEM parts onto the race trike until it was faster than out worn out pre-runners. That is what we entered and used to win the Baja 1000 that year. What happened to the "A" team?
Seems as though they broke down early in the race. Anyway, it was a sweet victory and my last ride for Team Honda ATC.

After reading some of these posts, it may appear as though I'm bitter and may have a poor outlook. I do not. Not one tiny bit. The good times clearly outnumbered the bad. I have no ill feelings about Marty Hart either. He was an excellent racer, but there were some agonizing events towards the end of my racing career at Honda that he was involved with, along with some troubling personal issues with the ATC Team mangement and my feelings of being handicapped with "lesser" performance equipment from Paul Turner.

Mike

[Ol Deuce]

WoW.......what a recap of the ending events !it seems in all Racing, Stuff goes on !!! Mike Coe ......Ya did Good!!!!!!! Ol Deuce