adding a battery system to a 200x

[brendan802]

I was thinking about adding a battery to my new 200x so I'd be able to run more lights and so it would be less stress on the stator. Would it be less stress for the stator coil with a battery??? I was thinking that since the battery would have a full charged battery it would then suck the juice from the battery while the stator keeps a trickle charge going to the battery. I've got a regulator from a big red that I was going to hook up to prevent damage. Do you think this will work.

[TeamGeek6]

The idea of not loading the stator wont work unless the battery is disconnected from the stator. The battery in a battery -charging system acts as a filter to remove the AC from the system, with the power coming from the stator.

Would take a fairly large battery to source a headlight, and vibration on an ATV is not kind to batteries.

IT all depends on the stator. The regulator might work, try it on an old car headlight first. Voltage climbs as RPMs increase, so the regulator is especially important at high revs.

[brendan802]

Thanks for the info I'll try that.

[TeamGeek6]

Just watch the stator temperature, measure it stock, then with extra load and realize that its sealed up inside the case without much place for the heat to escape. Heat is the main limit. Ive rewound them for more output on Goldwings, and there are other companies that do similar things.

[bigredhead]

Well.. my understanding of all this is that the windings( on the stator ) pass over an electrical field ( magnets ) wich generate current... wich recharge the battery , run the lights etc.. the more windings you have the more power is made.. The stator produces AC ( alternating current ) , your battery needs DC ( Direct Current ) to recharge, and no higher than 14v ( A fully charged SLA battery should read 12.8 to 13.5 v at rest ) if you give a 12v battery more than 14v's.. you fry it.

.. a 12v SLA ( Sealed Lead Acid ) battery should not be charged at moVEre than 14v or so.. VERY IMPORTANT.

The regulator basically limits the voltage to the battery.. and the battery feeds the lights.

How many poles on the X stator have windings ? are they all used ? or only a few ?

[brendan802]

Don't know haven't tore it apart yet.

[fyi]

Teamgeek or anyone else~
Does the 200x brendon has or the 350x I have utilize a voltage rectifier of some sort, either within the regulator for lighting or in the CDI unit for ignition? I would think it would have to somehow... If so, is it full of half-phase? I'm curious on the battery thing also since I'll be integrating one into my machine permanantly so it can be charged for the long-term. Thanx! :)

[TeamGeek6]

Motorcycles in general use a shunt regulator, 3 wire (in, out, ground) on my 250R, that shunts the excess energy to ground. A shorted inductor (stator) does not generate much heat when shorted (electrical physics junk ). The stator on my R goes to wel over 30V DC if rectified, just explodes a headlight at about 3000 RPM. Most of the smaller cycles should have AC electrical systems for the lights, they dont care if its AC or DC. The circuit board in my carb thread is a rectifier and 14 volt switching regulator.

A typical lead- acid battery should charge at 14.8 V max. At 15.5, they start to lose water. At 16 + (magic land) they start to get 'ruint' but MAN DO THEY RUN! Not for the inexperienced... :eek:

[fyi]

Hmmmm, interesting..... I've got a few more questions, but I'll ask it in another thread, as not to hi-jack Brendon's with topics other than his own. :)

[Muddy200x]

Honda made a kit for adding a battery to a 200s and it's easy to retro fit it to a 200x. If you can find one of these kits its definitely the way to go. Here's a post I made about it a while back. http://www.3wheelerworldforums.com/showthread.php?t=24845&highlight=200x+battery+power
I wish I could be more help. I have the Honda part number and a couple of detailed pictures of the kit but the computer that the're on is down at the moment.

[fyi]

Thank you! That's exactly what I (and brendan) are probably looking for. I'm pretty fluent with electrical systems [just a bit rusty] and I program EFI engines everyday, so now your post (and prior posts) have sparked my interest even more. ;)

[bigredhead]

NEVER charge a lead acid battery at 16v..... i repeate NEVER.

only a handful of brands can handle this " Hawker HP's " for example... and you don't put those on trikes.

You will boil the acid in them and risk a FIRE !!!!!!

[brendan802]

Go ahead and ask FYI. It might help me out through this hole process. :w00t:

[fyi]

OK, here goes....

Since I plan to add nitrous on this thing permanantly this winter~ which uses many DCV powered components, I'll need to add a battery, amoungst other things, to make it all work durably and correctly. Plus, the 350x electrical system is very antiquated in design, especially for something that's 20+ years old....

With that said, I purchased an entire electrical wiring harness and related ignition/lighting/switching components for a 2004 450R ATV, so that I can entirely upgrade the electrical system on my machine. Additionally, I can then use the Dynatek Programmable Ignition System that will allow for custom spark-curves for the bigger intended engine combination planned this winter too. I also bought a new 450R carb as well that has the TPS required for the programmable ignition module, which also has an accel. pump shot fuel circuit. I haven't purchased a 450R manual yet, so I'm not familar with the system's design.

My questions is to TeamGeek6 or others that may have insight: Does the 450R's ignition/charging system have the capability to accept a battery for my needs with it's newer design?

It seems that it does, because in looking at other late model TRX- ATV's that have an electric start w/ onboard batteries, the wiring harnesses aren't much different and I'd bet I could sort out how to adapt a rectifier from one of them onto this new harness. I just have to brush a few cobwebs from my noggin from what I learned back in college about stuff like that. :)

Thanks for letting me ask here brendan.. ;)

[TeamGeek6]

My questions is to TeamGeek6 or others that may have insight: Does the 450R's ignition/charging system have the capability to accept a battery for my needs with it's newer design?



The battery is somewhat immaterial, the power for all the devices comes from the charging system (stator). All charging sytems are designed to take a battery. Might be a more interesting question of "where to mount it."

They dont tend to be put in ATVs because of the severe beating they take, they get short enough life in street bikes between vibration and engine heat.

The battery is there for starting, or when the charging voltage is below battery voltage. If the charging is working, the battery disappears except for acting as a filter to average out voltage peaks, and drawing a small current. Except for possibly start - up, Id guess that entire system can be run with large capacitors thus eliminating the battery. Capacitors will take much more G-forces than a battery and much easier to mount.

FYI, that 750 i told you about had a Dyna - S running at 16.5 volts, pure evil.

[fyi]

I'm not too concerned about battery longevity/durability because I've seen just how long some of these small ATV batteries last long-term, especially on ATV's that have been rode hard. My wife's 1999 Honda Foreman 450s 4x4 has been rode very hard from the previous owner, making the machine a real work-in-progress to fix up.

About the only item not requiring attention on that thing is the battery.... Cranks the engine over very easily every time and all the cells are still full. Therefore, that's a testiment of durability proof enough for me and if it can live through the torture the Foreman went through for nearly 7 years now, it can surely work well for my machine at a mere fraction of that kind of use.

I'll figure it out somehow when I get time and post back when I do brendan.

[TeamGeek6]

I'm not too concerned about battery longevity/durability because I've seen just how long some of these small ATV batteries last long-term, especially on ATV's that have been rode hard. My wife's 1999 Honda Foreman 450s 4x4 has been rode very hard from the previous owner, making the machine a real work-in-progress to fix up.

About the only item not requiring attention on that thing is the battery.... Cranks the engine over very easily every time and all the cells are still full. Therefore, that's a testiment of durability proof enough for me and if it can live through the torture the Foreman went through for nearly 7 years now, it can surely work well for my machine at a mere fraction of that kind of use.

I'll figure it out somehow when I get time and post back when I do brendan.


Agreed, but the 450 etc are sport / utility models. I wouldnt place much hope in a battery surviving in a 250R like mine that does (did) 5 foot down straight drops and double jumps with handlebars slammed into the sides of whoops. Big difference in abuse. Im guessing that is a dividing line between "battery or not battery?"

Sure, battery would easily hold up to tuning and drag racing, thats done every day.