ATC 200m Problems

[rick123]

Good Day Everyone

I have been a reader of the forms for awhile now but i have never posted. I have a problem with my new 1984 atc 200m. I have never owned a 3-wheeler before and have never had to work on one.

I bought this 200m about 2 weeks ago and it is in rough shape. I the guy i bought it from told me it needed a new oil pump and he gave me one along with the trike. When i opened the side of the engine i noticed that the oil was grey and almost frozen ( i am up in canada, it is freezing here) so i cleaned out all the crap grey oil that was in there and changed the oil pump. I put the engine back together and filled it up with honda 5w30 oil, it ran for a couple of min when i noticed a leak from the side that i opened. ( bad gasket) but the oil that i just put in was white and frothy, it looked almost like milk, when the trike is running and i pull out the oil dip stick, it shoots out oil from there. the trike wont idle and i dont think the top end of the engine is getting any oil.

Like i said i am a newbie to the world of 3-wheelers and any help or suggestion would be great!

Thanks

[mx600]

milky oil indicates water. If it is water, and it's cold out, you could freeze it, which could then block oil passageways, etc. I'm not sure how you can make sure all the water is out. I guess I'd just keep flushing it with oil. I'm sure someone else here will have some good suggestions.

[Mobular]

Could also be a really sludgy deposit from lack of regular maintenance. If is sludge or a frozen water situation, I recommend not running it at all until you can be sure that oil is getting to the topend. This is a real easy way to destroy the cam and journals. Take the machine inside, or use a heavy tarp over the trike and a heater to thaw it out. Once it's warm, run it and change the oil a few times to clean it out.

[kando]

Sounds like the guy you bought it from never changed oil. Change it again to help clean out water condensate. This could take a few flushes. Clean oil screen filter. I would check that oil is actually getting to top end by removing big round plug on top of head to see in there while its running, new p/p could be air locked. A compression test wouldn't hurt also to see what shape this motor is in. Also idling problem is probably from carb all gummed take it off and clean everything inside and the two jets in there. That should keep you busy for awhile. Where you from anyways?

[rick123]

Thanks for all the help everyone,
I think i may tear the whole engine apart, this thing is in really rough shape, i pulled the muffler off and it is clogged so bad it is a solid chunk of hard mud.

If i pull the engine apart i can see if all the oil guides are clear and clean everything out. i was worried about the oil shooting out of the dip stick hole, someone told me it could be a compression problem. the trike seems to have good compression.

I am Ottawa Ontario BTW

[kando]

As for muffler being plugged maybe that is why it trys to come out dipstick. Do a compression test, that way you know whats going on in there, and by the way welcome to this site. :Bounce

[rick123]

I pulled the muffler right off and i am just running a straight pipe for now.
i really dont want to pull the engine completly apart but i dont think i have a choice. The guy i bought it from claims to have put in a new piston and rings but when he put it back together he used some kind of blue silicone for a gasket and when i opened the bottom end to change the oil pump i found pieces of blue silicone in with the oil. i just want to ride the trike, i have had it for 2 weeks and haven't even had one ride :(

Oh well, next weekend i will pull it apart and hope for the best.

[bigredhead]

If you are unsure wether you got oil getting to the head or not, i'd open the valve covers and check.. consider pouring a bit of oil in there if it looks dry before trying to start it again.

If you could get it to start and run for a minute or 2, then drain the oil, fill it up again, and keep doing this until you get clear oil out of it . Then check the valves again for oil and see if the pump is doing it's thing !!

[rick123]

Well, i am pretty sure the top end is not getting any oil, what concerns me is the white oil, it seems to frothy, like it is white because of tiny little bubbles in the oil, kinda like a frother on a cappacino machine. I am pretty sure that if i take the engine apart i can clear out the guides and get oil pumping to the top end, i have just never seen oil like this.

Rick

[bigredhead]

that white frosty stuff is WATER.

I bet you he drowned it at one point, or water is getting in somehow, thru the case breather, pull starter, etc...

[straight pipe]

just wondering if he over did it on the silicone stuff and it is jamming up somethin in the oiling system. and ya sounds like it has been drowned and not flushed out right away to me. i don't think you have a choice but to open it up. where you bought it from has there been flooding? just wondring

[rick123]

OK, all signs are pointing at water, and possibly a "clogged" oil passage. So i guess i am opening it up. Is there and tricks or things i should watch out for, or is it straight forward. I ordered a service maniual for it, but it wont be in of a couple of weeks.

[bigredhead]

I'd try flushing it out before opening the cases...

Get a Gallon of cheap stuff from walmart, penzoil or the like, drain, fill, put oil in valve covers so it does not run dry.. start it for a minute, drain, re-fill. start.. etc...

IF the passages are clogged with ice, they should melt quickly once it warms up.. and you can flush it out that way.

opening it up will lead to stripped nuts and bolts, cost of new gaskets etc.. and much cursing and swearing.

Even if partially cloged, as long as you have soem oil in the head, running at idle won't be instant death..

[fhportal]

I'd drain it, pour about 2/3s the required oil in it (1.3 qts is norm I believe) and fill it the rest the way up with kerosene (or by the oil flush from automotive shop) and run it a awhile (after you oil the top end by hand) then flush and repeat until it (the whiteness) clears up. I did this with a IH Farmal Tractor that was flooded durring hurricane Floyd. Now it is clear and runs great... good luck...

[bigredhead]

Kerosene ??????? what ?

never hear of that one before ???

[kando]

I wouldn't open it up either, just keep changing oil but check filter first.

[MTS]

Take it all apart, if the hick used silicone for gaskets on it you can be sure the oil gallys are pluged up, along with the oil screen, he has sunk it and didnt flush it out, take it all apart, flush the bottem end throughly with diesel or varsol, get some new proper head and base gaskets, and i hope you whernt running it without the header pipe off...., anyways if you want it to be done right do as i mentiond...dont bother trying to piss around with flushing it out the way it is...you wont get all the silicon out, this can lead to a cam siezure , which is not nice....take it apart and clean it very througly take both side cases off and clean the oil screens out and get new gaskets for them....Get quality OEM honda gaskets for it....the motor rebuild itself is very simple, takes all of half hour to put it toghther...good luck!

[fhportal]

kerosene works great... some people freak think they'll risk fire, but with the low combustion point there is little worry. Diesel fuel works well also. In the antique tractor crowd they use this trick often in the gear cases (xmission, rear-end) to remove deposits and give a good flushing. just don't run it too long becuase is does reduce the lubricating function of the oil.... Cant beat it for 2 bucks a gallon...

[rick123]

Thanks for all the help everyone!
I ordered new gaskets today and will tear it apart on the weekend, my manual came in and it looks faily easy to tear down and rebuild.

Again, thanks for all the help. With any luck I will be riding by the end of the weekend :)

[wmurray4452]

ok it sat outside all winter and i brought it into the garage and it fired right up and i pushed the gas and it got stuck so i took off the carburator cap and got it unstick and up it on again and it started up and reved u all the way by itself so i took the cap off again and got a new throttle cable and i got the cable on and it is still reving up when i turn it on. i also took the carb. apart and cleaned it all out and the jets and put it back on and it still does it idk whats making it do it. does anyone have any ideas.

[pimpallic]

Did you put the slide in correctly? It has to line up properly or else it won't drop in properly.