Need idea/picture for 2 wheel conversion

[frankydodo]

Hey guys! I finall decided to make a 2 wheel fat bike out of m 1983 atc 200!

I know that i'm going to need a jackshaft setup because the rear sprocket will not line with the engine sprocket.

But for the swingarm setup i kinda need some idea. I've seen alot of build on youtube but not an detailed picture!

There are mainly 2 option i'm seeing.

1: take some 1x3 steel tubing and put sone pillow block bearing at the end for the axle.


2 : this one i found it on youtube and look pretty good also. Its to take a front fork out of a 1981-1982 200 (no suspension) put a wheel on it and find a way to put the sprocket on a front wheel hub.


I would like to add shock also. So if you have any good tips or idea/pictue they are welcome!!

Frank

[frankydodo]

Well i guess i'll start ut alone guys! This week i cut the rear end and i ask a machinist to make me a rear sprocket and wheel hub.

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/02/04/14529dd32083b2eec945549cc314ea07.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/02/04/80d9ca5dd60186210d635495e7ded263.jpg

And finally i will make the swingarm with some 1x2 and a mono shock design with maybe a 400ex rear shock. Like this designhttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/02/04/bf5fb107d1c4480dd3ca13907dca9d0b.jpg

[ps2fixer]

I was expecting a missile based design, build build so far. What are your plans for a rear fender to keep the engine from getting caked from the back side and the underside of your seat/air box?

Personally, I'd run the bearings on the opposite side of the swing arm, gives more grown clearance for it. I guess the down side would be putting the bearings closer to harms way if you did ever bottom out on something like passing by a stump or something.

[frankydodo]

Yeah the bearing will be upside down ! And i have to say that i did not think about a rear fender setup yet haha. My part will be ready this weekend so i will be able to start the swing arm soon

[bumsted200s]

For what its worth. My brother and I did something along the lines you're trying to do. But to an '82 not '83 (his frame broke) so wasn't wrecking a good one.

A trip to Fleet Farm for bearings, home made jack-shafts, and a new trailer fender cut in half long way re-welded. Basically sums up what we did. Good luck with yours



Brian

my wheelers:
1981 Honda 200 5-wheeler
1983 Honda 200
1982 Honda 185S
1983 Honda 250R
1984 Honda 200S
1985 Honda 200X
1985 Honda 200 auto-X (for sale) http://www.3wheelerworld.com/showthread.php/177696-*For-Sale*-1985-Honda-ATC-200X-(auto-x)
1987 Honda 250SX

227368227369227370

[frankydodo]

Hey man thanks for the reply and picture ! Nice build ! Can't wait to finish mine

[barnett468]

xlnt, this is cool and the video shot looks cool . . i know your not building a pro motocross bike but i would try to set the angle of the rear shock to the best angle possible to get the best performance out of it.

buy an angle finder or protractor from the hardware store.

tack weld all the suspension mounts in so they can be removed as needed.

remove the shock spring.

after you determine how what ride height you want then measure the distance from the top of the rear tire to the bottom of some type of fender or where a fender would be.

next, raise the swingarm until it reaches the point where you want the suspension to stop then measure from the top of the tire to some point on the frame just above it . . you can also use the angle finder to check both these positions.

move the mounts around until you have the amount of travel you want then check the shock angle.

mount the shock so it is at or slightly less than 90 degrees to the angle of the line from the center of the swingarm pivot to the center of the rear axle bolt . . this will prevent the shock ratio from becoming "digressive" at the end of the suspension travel.
.

[frankydodo]

I started my swingarm with 1x2 tubing i will not use a front fork finally.

I want to put my swingarm pivot on pillow block bearing . I saw some design with a swingarm but without bearing but i dont want to do that.

The jackshaft bearing will be on the swingarm itself. ( like the power modz power cat check it out on youtube )

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/02/08/649c23ab018c5b6fcb7677c10a217fd2.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/02/08/bcc6d2fdb3d48133f950dce7063c750e.jpg

[ps2fixer]

Just a fair warning, which ever pair of sprockets has the pivot point will get looser/tighter as the suspension works. I suspect the longer the distance the more forgiving it is, and the placement of the pivot point makes a huge difference too. In a perfect world, the center of the jack shaft would be your pivot point and there would be zero length differences from the suspension.

Just keep that in mind as you're building it so frame bars etc don't get in the way of the chain, and hopefully the chain does not get too loose/tight. You could make up some sort of chain tensioner similar to the atc90 setup.

Just in my mind, you could probably make the pivot point the same as the front shaft for the jack shaft since it looks plenty heavy enough to hold the weight of the machine, It will be kind of odd with a spinning swing arm "bolt" though lol.

[frankydodo]

Lol at the swingarm spining pivot bolt ! I actually think of that too but im not sure about that !

And i will probably add an spring loaded chain tensioner too.

And ps2fixer are you talking about the chain going from the engine to the jackshaft or the jackshaft going ro the rear sprocket that will become loose? I was thinking that if the jackshaft system is on the swingarm itself it would reduce the tight/loose effect

And i will not use a mono shock design. The rear wheel would be to far back from the atc. I've found a gokart site that sells all kind of stuff. And i bought :

3/4" keyed jackshaft
3/4" locking collar
I also found a kickstand!

And they also sells shock of different length for cheap. Also they sells shock mount bracket too!

[frankydodo]

If i look at this picture the jackshaft position by the pivot point will be closely the same and this guy does not have a tensioner. http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/02/08/b615cc968e05434475bc81634049746e.jpg

[ps2fixer]

In the photo of the video, the rear sprocket to jack shaft will be were the slack is made. Based on the layout of what I can see, it will loosen when you compress the suspension. If the swingarm bolt and jackshaft are the same shaft, there will be no chains being effected. If the swing arm bolt is between the engine and jackshaft, then the engine between the two will be the effected chain.

Spring loaded tentioners will probably be best. You could slot the bearing mounts for which ever chain is static/not changing and move the whole bearing assembly to tighten. Think of it kind of like how the rear wheel on a dirt bike adjusts. 3 wheelers are the same basic setup, just a bit more complex except the smaller hard tails, I think they all had the inline tentioner on the slack side of the chain.

[frankydodo]

The pillow block bearing holes are already sloted ! And i think ill add an automatic chain tensioner just to be safe! But right now im still waiting for my wheel and sprocket hub :(

[ps2fixer]

Ahh didn't notice that in the photos, not a lot of adjustment but enough for atleast 1 link or so.

I bet if someone made a weld on kit there would be an ok demand for them.

[jb2wheels]

...Just in my mind, you could probably make the pivot point the same as the front shaft for the jack shaft since it looks plenty heavy enough to hold the weight of the machine, It will be kind of odd with a spinning swing arm "bolt" though lol...

Doesn't this solve the problem with chain adjustment changes during suspension travel? It would be cool to look at, too.

[ps2fixer]

Doesn't this solve the problem with chain adjustment changes during suspension travel? It would be cool to look at, too.

Yes, that is what I was getting at in the post.


Not unless someone was just giving them away for charity, and intended to end up in the poorhouse because of it.


Do some searching about the Missile Engineering kit for the 250R. Look at how much it cost back then. That was a bolt on kit that didn't require frame modification. Anything for a hardtail means there is no going back.

More recently there was this business - http://www.bigwheelconversion.com/

I watched him on the internet when he started designing the kits several years ago. This year, he just listed the entire business on Ebay and the top bid was only $3,400.

Interesting.. I think the auction's value was more or less the machine included rather than the business. I won't claim to be amazing at marketing or anything, but the website is under 50 views / day and only 1500 likes for something that has been around for "several years" seems like bad marketing and not enough effort in exposure and getting the word out more. The 50k youtube views is more on par what I'd expect and am kind of shocked it is so high vs everything else.

Just to put in context... I do basically zero marketing on my webstore in my sig, it has been online since 2013, and it gets around 100-120 unique views per day average with peaks on the weekends into 1200-1500. I just don't see how a simple webstore with not really much for sale can out perform something unique like that, even if the kits were overly expensive.

I guess I should reword my statement, if there was an affordable weld on kit, there might be demand for it. I personally thought the fat cats were pretty neat, and converting a parts machine into a fat cat would be something I'd do if the kit was cheap enough. I have access to a welder, but not the area to build something from the ground up.

[frankydodo]

Well i guess i need to do a little update! The cold quebec winter is almost over ! Today it was a beautiful day ! (Also my b-day haha) and i worked on the fat cat atc.


I have to say that i never weld before. I practice a little on some scrap metal and watched alot of youtube videos before. I think my welds turned out ok!

A couple weeks ago i received my rear axle and also my wheel and sprocket hub!

So right now it looks like this

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/03/13/302059c6d0cd7275e97954f4844481b8.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/03/13/a749ad7d508366fd9954d136dba7eb32.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/03/13/ef414aeaa635c1690c9801337e652055.jpg

I'm kind of surprised of how well its going right now! I still have alot of job to do but its going in the right direction!!

I still have to find a good way to mount the upper bolt of the rear shock.

[ps2fixer]

I couldn't see the welds very well in the photos, but they don't look too bad of what I can tell. At least they are not the "bubblegum welds" (weld wasn't hot enough, too much material too fast) I see so often on our trikes. Welding isn't hard to do as a hobby, but there are a bit more advanced things that can be learned as well.

What is wrong with the upper shock bolts where they are? Just looks like you need a shorter bolt and there is 2 bolt holes to adjust the height a little.

Not sure how strong them shocks are, but moving them forward would allow for more travel of the rear wheel, and will make the ride a bit softer. However if the shocks are not all that strong, then they would bottom out easy if moved forward. I suspect it will be a something to play around with after the machine is together.

Weather down in Michigan is a little warmer it looks like =), been hitting 40-50s lately, snow is basically gone everywhere finally! Now it is all mud.

[frankydodo]

I have to say that the hardest part of welding is not the weld itself. Its to find the right setting for the machine that was hard.

I practice myself one after noon just welding scrap metal and messing around with the setting until i found a good one

[frankydodo]

Starting to looks like something!http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/03/18/ed810dc763205a21b58f2cfffd81c88d.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/03/18/20e96ea0a52c76025c28f3795d50f5b5.jpg

[frankydodo]

Finally its on 2 wheel !http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160409/21bb0ba35696ddf04f568dfd4b48d061.jpg
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160409/5ab05eeb769b0f53196fc637f90f195d.jpg

New front brake and front wheel bearing

Also discovered a massive play in the steering bearing! I guess ill go with allballs one!

[ps2fixer]

I never heard anything negative about the allballs brand, so should be a good choice =).

It is coming along quite well. If/when I catch up on all my million of side projects, I might have to try something like that with a 185s frame and a 200x engine. I'd be going for a little more travel though and the 200x front end if it swaps.

[frankydodo]

Finally a (little) update guys!

I didnt have many time in the last week to work on the fat atc. But last weekend i took a whole day to work on it!

And after 2 trial to get the chain align and everything. I changed all the jackshaft setup. I wanted to put 2 pillow block on the upper part of my swingarm. But it was total crap. Then i tried 2 bolt flange bearing on the inside part of the swingarm. Total bullshit also.

I finally copied a design i saw online with some square tubing welded on the frame and i did that ! Best desicion ever haha.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160516/4583ac8a664f39d971cba0162d747992.jpg

It was wayyyyy more easy than all the other crap i tried.

I also ordered a pit bike exhaust that i will fit because the stock pipe exit on the center of the frame where the rear wheel is.

Also ordered a spring loaded chain tensionner of ebay.

Right now it sits like this!http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160516/969ea281c615482f5afa95924c6e1375.jpg

Oh! I also installed my new wiring harness from ps2fixer ! It fires on the first pull! Way too loud with just the header!

Frank!