Shocking issue ATC110

[Micahdogg]

I've got two 1979 ATC110's with the points motors and one 1984 ATC110 with the CDI motor. If I ride these machines in the rain, or snow or get them wet at all - both of the 1979's will shock you if you touch anything metal. Obviously the source is the spark plug wire, but why it travels through anything metal on the frame is beyond me. It gets worse, the wetter the machine gets. And in some cases, if you bomb through a puddle, it misfires and dies out and needs a minute or so to recover (and it's not sucking water in the airbox)

You can feel it through gloves, through the metal throttle housing and handbars as a mild buzzing as you ride. If you touch the plastic spark plug boot with a glove on as it idles, you get shocked bad enough that you can hold onto your buddy with your free arm and shock him :)

I thought it was just an issue with one of the 1979's, but I noticed it with the other machine as we were riding in the rain. Both of them have hard plastic spark plug boots that aren't very well insulated at all, could this be the culprit? I haven't seen any obvious problems with torn wiring or exposed wires touching anything out of the ordinary. And otherwise they are both in really good condition.

Any tips would be appreciated. Oh, and the 1984 runs fine when wet.

[kb0nly]

I would replace the plug wire and boot, the hard boot should have a rubber cap on the end that goes over the plug, sealing the water out of the cap and keeping the plug dry inside the cap. The rubber end cap is lost most of the time.

If you got that much voltage leakage to the frame though i would look over the plug wire and also the condenser and wiring to see if something is rubbed through enough to make everything live. Definitely shouldnt have that problem... LOL

[C.J]

You've gotta replace the coil to replace the plug wire, but you can find a heat shrink or slip cover to put over it and t'll help you some. Also i would DEFINITELY check all your grounds. the reason its buzzing the frame is that the engine is hunting for a ground source.

[Micahdogg]

THanks for the tips. The plug wires are fine on both, but the rubber caps at the end of the boots are both missing.

How do I check all the grounds? It's more that just wiring, but all the mount from the engine to the frame too right? Would this occur if water got in the stator or in the points cover?

[kb0nly]

The main ground on these is the motor itself as the stator is grounded to the case of the motor, then the motor is grounded to the frame via its mounting bolts. If you got water in the stator you could have a corroded/bad ground connection in there. If you got water up in the points cover i would go through and cleanup that as well. I agree with CJ, its most likely due to a bad ground connection. Plus it doesnt hurt to go through all the connections as well.

[C.J]

Just take and unbolt an drop the motor out. Go after the frame and the engine cases with some 80 grit sand paper and get them all shiny where everything touches. Not real hard, just takes a little time.

I think it's 3-12mm bolts with 12mm nuts on the head stay (just loosen the very front one, dont remove the back headstay bolt till after the 2 big bolts/nuts are off on the rear of the engine). 2 14 or 16mm bolts that actually hold the engine in the back with 16mm nuts on them (I think it's 16). Once you get those two out, if you've got the front head stay bolt loose and the bottom head stay bolt (the one that's actually through the head cap), you can pull the back head sty bolt and push the motor forward and it'll drop and swing out. Makes it a lot easier bolting the engine back in too

[Micahdogg]

I'll go over all that stuff, but I don't understand what sanding the connections from the motor to the frame will do. I only have a ground problem when something is getting wet - and on both same year ATC's. When its dry, you can touch the plug boot and not get shocked.

So even if water corroded some connections in the stator, that would be a full time problem right? Now that I think about it, I don't think trace amounts of water in the stator would do anything. And I think the points covers are sealed well enough.

I'm starting to think water is getting in the plug boot and causing it to arc down the side of the spark plug to the cylinder. I guess if there was a steady stream of water from the tip of the plug down the side of it that could cause some residual leakage (buzzing). Then a hefty dose of water causes straight up misfires? Does this sound plausible?

[wisconsinite]

Crack in the coil itself maybe?

[tri again]

No real answer but I DO remember leaning over a trike, full wad of car keys in my left front pants pocket which just happened to arc from the engine thru my car keys and you can guess where it went from there.
Folded me in half for an hour.

[C.J]

You'd be surprised at the stuff electricity will and won't do,,, lol

But yea I see what you're saying.

I'd get after everything ground related still as well as getting one of the NGK plug boots. It's got a rubber coating all the way around it and it seals around the wire pretty well.

[MattDragontamer]

On an older thread it was the kill switch that was shorting out.
Get a new kill switch and try it out. Electricity will always use the easiest path
or path of least resistance.

I figure you are getting the shocks from your throttle housing to your hand because the kill
switch is arcing. This happens to older parts as the integrity is compromised.
It is exposed to the rain and when it gets wet it conducts electricity all that much easier.
So do that before changing anything else. If it continues proceed with the following.
It's not a bad idea to go over your wire harness and grounding terminals to ensure a
proper electrical circut. Replace the spark plug boots if compromised.

[just ben]

The kill switch just completes a ground. I had this issue once also,it ended up being a bare wire to the headlight touching the handlebars.

[Larry T Moore]

start it up at night...turn off the lights and spray water in various places...itll show up with little sparks...I had an 80 110 that kept doing that...took us weeks...went for a night ride after it rained..started it up and it looked like a christmas tree...

[3wheelrider]

Ive seen where the rubber coverings for the wire "ends" leak thru the rubber coverings. Put some heat shrink over them where they plug together. Ive seen this happen on the black wire behind the headlight. Also the blk./red wire from stator touching the frame. The rubber gets degraded/cracked & leaks out current especially when wet.

[3wheelrider]

Ive seen where the rubber coverings for the wire "ends" leak thru the rubber coverings. Put some heat shrink over them where they plug together. Ive seen this happen on the black/wht. wire behind the headlight. Also the blk./red wire from stator touching the frame. The rubber gets degraded/cracked & leaks out current especially when wet.

[Micahdogg]

All good info. I'll probably start with replacing the scabby plug boot - where do I find an NGK rubber boot? Is there a specific part number people are using?

As for the kill switch, one of the 79's doesn't even have one (wires are tied up). You have to pull the choke and stab the throttle for the "Kill switch." The wires are tied up pretty well down by the frame.

[tri again]

The kill switch just completes a ground. I had this issue once also,it ended up being a bare wire to the headlight touching the handlebars.`

I got slammed just last week wiggling wires on the sx headlight.
Felt like a spark but was more likely the AC voltage coming out of the
stator on it's way to the regulator.
Not the same machine, I know, but that ac jolt was quite impressive.

[MJKH_BIGRED]

I had a 1973 Skidoo Olympique back in the day that would zap the hell out of you thru the handlebars. That turned out to be a faulty ground wire.

[badass350x]

Definitely a bad plug boot or ground!

[kb0nly]

The NGK plug boots can be found on eBay, thats where i usually buy them, not that expensive.

[83ATC185]

`

I got slammed just last week wiggling wires on the sx headlight.
Felt like a spark but was more likely the AC voltage coming out of the
stator on it's way to the regulator.
Not the same machine, I know, but that ac jolt was quite impressive.

I know this is old but we were trying to pull my 185s off after a rebuild and i had just twisted the wires coming from the stator to the harness and left them bare(ya know just to make sure it ran), reached down to choke it while he pulled me in 3rd gear pegged out and bumped those wires, i know exactly how that feels. My arm hurt for 3 days afterward.

And any luck solving this problem?