Big Red 200e - smoking bad - seafoam in oil to free rings question?

[afdfirefighter]

So I have an 83 200e big red. Smokes terrible. Have a feeling it's a stuck ring. Anyone put seafoam in their oil? Had any luck? How much should a guy use?183420

[tri again]

I actually read the directions.
It can be mixed with oil or gas or poured into the brake vacuum
suction hose on a car/truck to get sucked into the intake, back of the valves and combustion chamber while it's running.
Supposed to smoke like a &^^% so locals say to do THAT at night or fear wrath of eco neighbors.
I'd put an oz in the cyl and let it sit. or figure out a way to spray or squirt in into the intake while it's running.
or read the directions first in case I have my chemicals wrong.
They say it will NOT hurt the engine. but the smoke when sprayed into a running engine will scare mere mortals.

Do those engines have valve seals? Super cheap and can cause lot o' oil smoke.
How's the compression?

[tri again]

ps - any chance your oil got diluted with gas from a bad petcock?
I had one like that .
gas was low and oil level was too high because of the gas.
I Love ez fixes.

[jays375]

I would give it a quick compression test.Has the machine been sitting a long time?If so it could be a stuck ring.Does it smoke less after it warms up?Did you purchase it recently and change the oil?

[djm0242]

I always use Marvel Mystery Oil. Remove spark plug fill cylinder (preferably with piston all the way down) with MM and let it sit for as long as you can. At least several days. In the past I have removed the recoil starter and turned the crank slowly back and forth (spark plug still removed) couple times each day. Turn the crank too fast and you'll be wearing the MM oil! I have freed locked up engines and sticky rings multiple times with this technique. Put MM in your gas tank regularly to keep rings nice and make your top end last longer. I put a cup full in a full tank. It may smoke a tiny bit just use 3/4 cup next time. Hope this helps!

[MNhondaguy]

For locked up engines I've used brake fluid or diesel. Fr you application regular seafoam should work. I have used the seafoam brand fogging oil spray to winterize engines, that would likely work also. The way I have always done it was let engine run and up to temp, then spray fog oil through intake until engine dies. I prefer to do it after carb a doing it through the carb it dies almost right away.

[Rider414]

By the time you mess around doing all this, you could tear the the top end apart and do it right.

:confused:

[afdfirefighter]

Thanks for all the replies guys. I have not tested compression yet. I bought it not running, recoil was full of water so it's safe to say it has sat a good while. I tore the carb apart and cleaned it real well and it fired up but was pouring smoke out. I do not currently have a compression tester so for right now I will either pour a little in the spark plug hole and turn it a little bit or go get some marvel and try it out. Once again thanks for all the replies. Happy new year.

[tri again]

I always use Marvel Mystery Oil. Remove spark plug fill cylinder (preferably with piston all the way down) with MM and let it sit for as long as you can. At least several days. In the past I have removed the recoil starter and turned the crank slowly back and forth (spark plug still removed) couple times each day. Turn the crank too fast and you'll be wearing the MM oil! I have freed locked up engines and sticky rings multiple times with this technique. Put MM in your gas tank regularly to keep rings nice and make your top end last longer. I put a cup full in a full tank. It may smoke a tiny bit just use 3/4 cup next time. Hope this helps!

Yeah, dad keeps telling me MM oil is used for top end lube on small airplane engines.

[slashfan7964]

Running bad gas through it? My X smoked wildly after sitting for a long time until I ran the garbage gas through it, after that it went away.

[djm0242]

I have used the MM oil and used a heat gun to heat up the cylinder too. Heat will speed up the process, especially if it's pretty cold where you are. It really is good stuff, just keep the heat moving don't sit in one place with the heat too long. The goal is to heat evenly.

[kb0nly]

If its sat that long i would just change the oil again to flush it and then ride it around a while. The cylinder walls probably have some rust from sitting and it could wear in and clean up and stop smoking. Could... But chances are you have a worn bore and rings if its smoking all the time. As the other guys already mentioned if it only smokes a little bit when you start it and it goes away then its the valve stem seals, it leaks oil in when it sits and then burns it off when you start it back up. If its smoking all the time then its rings and bore where you have a problem.

But if its running pretty good, no extra noise other then the usual 200 valvetrain clank then i would just ride her good a while and see what she does. I had a 200M that sat for 13 years, cleaned the tank and carb, flushed it out with fresh oil, soaked the cylinder with PB Blaster and then the next day i added fresh fuel and a new plug and she fired up and smoked like a diesel for a half a day hauling stuff around pulling a trailer. Then the smoke got less and less, i stopped and checked the oil and the level was still ok, she just worked her issues out and hasnt smoked since.

Make sure you keep an eye on the oil level, and make sure your not overfilling it also. To check the level you don't screw the dipstick back in, just dip it, if you screw it in you will be underfilled. I realize thats not your issue just saying in case someone reading this doesnt know that.

[afdfirefighter]

If its sat that long i would just change the oil again to flush it and then ride it around a while. The cylinder walls probably have some rust from sitting and it could wear in and clean up and stop smoking. Could... But chances are you have a worn bore and rings if its smoking all the time. As the other guys already mentioned if it only smokes a little bit when you start it and it goes away then its the valve stem seals, it leaks oil in when it sits and then burns it off when you start it back up. If its smoking all the time then its rings and bore where you have a problem.

But if its running pretty good, no extra noise other then the usual 200 valvetrain clank then i would just ride her good a while and see what she does. I had a 200M that sat for 13 years, cleaned the tank and carb, flushed it out with fresh oil, soaked the cylinder with PB Blaster and then the next day i added fresh fuel and a new plug and she fired up and smoked like a diesel for a half a day hauling stuff around pulling a trailer. Then the smoke got less and less, i stopped and checked the oil and the level was still ok, she just worked her issues out and hasnt smoked since.

Make sure you keep an eye on the oil level, and make sure your not overfilling it also. To check the level you don't screw the dipstick back in, just dip it, if you screw it in you will be underfilled. I realize thats not your issue just saying in case someone reading this doesnt know that.

Good stuff! When you say soaked the cylinder with pb blaster did you just take the plug out and then let it sit? How do you get the blaster out after that? just crank it over? Sorry for the stupidity :-/

[kb0nly]

Yup, pulled the plug, grabbed the PB Blaster and used the spray tube on the can, but hold that SOB with your other hand in case it pops off you don't want it falling down the hole!! You can use the straw with the can and angle it around the plug hole to spray all the way around the cylinder wall.

Then i put the plug back in just to keep stuff out and so the PB can't evaporate that fast. Then the next day i pulled the plug back out, pulled it over slow a few times with the recoil to blow some of the excess out, then just reinstalled the plug and started it. The PB will burn off and make one hell of a cloud for a while!!

[afdfirefighter]

Yup, pulled the plug, grabbed the PB Blaster and used the spray tube on the can, but hold that SOB with your other hand in case it pops off you don't want it falling down the hole!! You can use the straw with the can and angle it around the plug hole to spray all the way around the cylinder wall.

Then i put the plug back in just to keep stuff out and so the PB can't evaporate that fast. Then the next day i pulled the plug back out, pulled it over slow a few times with the recoil to blow some of the excess out, then just reinstalled the plug and started it. The PB will burn off and make one hell of a cloud for a while!!

Perfect. I will deft need to try this. I'll have to take it out in the country on the trailer for the restart lol. I've got a lot of people living around me I'm sure I'd end up making a few people mad lol.

[kb0nly]

Oh you would definitely raise some eyebrows with the smell of burning PB Blaster.. It smells like Diesel fuel as is when it comes out of the can, it smells even worse burning... LOL

If a soakdown and some good spirited riding doesn't get rid of the smoking then you know for sure you need a top end rebuild. Expect around $200-$300 once you buy gaskets, timing chain and tensioner/guide bands and have the cylinder bored and honed and buy a new piston and rings. Also do a valve job if and when you tear into it. Then you got something that will last another 20+ years if you treat it right with oil changes and maintenance.

Since it sat so long i would for sure at least get a right cover gasket and a centrifugal oil filter gasket, or just buy a complete bottom end gasket set so you have all the various gaskets for maintenance jobs, and get that right side cover off and pull the clutch cover off and clean the gunk buildup out of that centrifugal oil filter. It basically slings the oil around that on the 200's and it ends up collecting a lot of sludge in there. If it goes to long you end up starving the top end of oil flow and taking out the head and the cam. Good maintenance tip for you!

If you need the manual its on my website, link below in my signature.

[Chopsaw]

I found an 84 200es that sat in a barn not running for about 2 years . Mine smoked , still does from time to time .

if you put oil in the cylinder , make sure you get it out before you put the plug back in and try to run it .

If you do run a compression test there is a certain way to do it , I think its choke full on throttle wide open .

Put fresh oil , fresh gas , and ride it where you can run it in high gear .