Changing swinger bearings to bushings, got a question...

[Qdude79]

Does this collar come out/off? It looked like a piece of the swinger when I banged out the bearings...
http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk39/qdude79/3A58304D-689A-4C0C-B57A-EED5DE693D1B-5761-000005F6B02D1A7B.jpg:wondering

[tri again]

What year / machine?
I've done a 250r and 250sx swing arm bearings / bushings.

Do you have a
service manual?

A parts diagram may also go a long way until you get some better advice.

At least it doesn't look rusty like all of mine.

[barnett468]

Hello


That is a removable collar, see page in link below. It looks like your arm has been very HEAVILY coated powder coating or something thick. There is a clearly defined machined area on each end of the swing arm. You will see that machined area in the manual and on your swing arm if you look closely. I can clearly make them out in the photo. This area as well as the collar shown in your photo is covered by the metal dust seal which has a rubber inner to seal out dust and water etc.

What year and model is it exactly?


OEM 81-84 250r manual see page 13-12

http://www.oscarmayer.net/atc/manuals/honda/atc250r_81-84_servicemanual.pdf


Hope this info helps.

[atc300r]

Yes both collars have to come out. I have a set in my 83 250r swingarm.Top swingarm.167068

[Qdude79]

My apologies, fellas, it was late and I forgot to mention that it's an '85 250R. :rolleyes: Just got it back from powder coat.

[barnett468]

My apologies, fellas, it was late and I forgot to mention that it's an '85 250R. :rolleyes: Just got it back from powder coat.


Hello


That's what I figured so here's your potential problem. The end cap seals act like a spacer without them your swing arm will have a little play and you will have to take up extra clearance by tightenung bolt causing slight stress in frame. Not the best thing, not the worst. Your end caps may not go over swing arm paint enough to properly seat. This means once installed your swing arm will be too wide to fit. If they do not go down all the way, either remove the rubber seal on the sides or get a file and file away that nice new powder coating on the machined lips I spoke of. You can also grind the end seals so they are a bit more shallow.


Hope this info helps.

[Qdude79]

Ok Barnett, so if I'm reading you correctly, it may be a bit loose without the end caps, may be too tight with 'em. Correct?

[Qdude79]

Also, the service manual says to knock these things out with a drift. With them being in there so tight after 27+ years (presumably), is there another method that might be better? I picture myself with a bfh, and I don't like that.

[Dave8338]

They are a press fit and not all that tight. Looking at how clean yours are, a couple smacks with a drift and a hammer and they'll likely fall out and hit the floor. They go back in with a few taps of a small dead blow or can be pressed in if you have access to a press (though NOT needed).

[Qdude79]

I'll give it a few good pops and see what happens. I just know how things can get with "the hamma."

[El Camexican]

You can also try lining up the bushing with a slightly undersized socket on one side and an oversized socket on the other and then put it all in a bench vise and push them out. Get an extra pair of hands to help you so you don’t wreck that powder-coating. The sockets might not be long enough to get them all the way out, but at least they will be freed up. You can put the new ones in the same way or build a tool with threaded rod and some washers to pull them into the swing-arm.

PS. Do whatever you have to in order run the sealing end caps, you’ll be glad you did in the long run.

[Mr. Clean]

According to Qdude79's thread title he is changing his swinger "bearings" to "bushings".

If this is in fact accurate then that collar is no longer required and should be just coaxed out of the swinger. It should not be that big of a deal to put a socket with extension or drift or equivalent and drive it out.

Here is a 250r swinger with the bushings installed, no collars or sleeves required.

http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk179/miked1957_photo/DSC_9468.jpg

[Qdude79]

All good advice, fellas, thank you. Gonna try the hammer for a bit, sockets if that doesn't work. With any luck, they'll pop right out and I'll have to find other ways to screw up my new powder!:w00t:

PS- Mr. Clean, how did you get a swinger on to a granite counter top and live to tell about it????

[Mr. Clean]

Part of your problem may be having that swinger powder coated with that collar installed. Is there any powder overlapped onto the collar?

Mrs. Clean is the BEST and the swinger and parts are perfectly CLEAN!!

[Qdude79]

There may be just a touch overlapped, as I recall.

Mrs. Qdude would have shot first, asked questions later!

[oldskool83]

were the holes cleaned free of powerd coat before bushing were in or was it coated with bushing in and how you want them out. I went with delrin bushing on mine. no more of the hassel with metal ones.

[Qdude79]

Bearings were removed. It's the bushings I'm looking to fit it with.

[barnett468]

Hello
Hello Qdude79


Powder coat has no structural integrity so it will not increase the difficulty of removing the collar. You can cut around the edge with a razor blade so it may not pull the powder coat off your arm if you want.

The socket and extension method mentioned above should work, you can also go to hardware store and buy a piece of metal piping a similar id and use that. It may have a sharper edge and the larger od compared to the drift will catch more area on the collar and be less likely to skip off. The drift can sometimes make a mess but it's easy to clean up however you MUST use the dreaded "HAMMA", with vigor, a 3 pounder works nicely, whack, whack, lol.


Hope this info helps

[El Camexican]

Mrs. Clean is the BEST and the swinger and parts are perfectly CLEAN!!

I asked Mr. Clean the same thing once about an in home photo and got a similar answer. I’m starting to suspect that he takes these outrageous photos when she’s not home and then “cleans” up the evidence before she gets back. Nothing else makes sense!

[Mrs. Clean]

I asked Mr. Clean the same thing once about an in home photo and got a similar answer. I’m starting to suspect that he takes these outrageous photos when she’s not home and then “cleans” up the evidence before she gets back. Nothing else makes sense!

Mrs. Clean here, I took this photo today getting some tires ready for atctim!! Recognize the counter and the kitchen!! :naughty:

http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk179/miked1957_photo/photo4_zps851ff81c.jpg (http://s280.photobucket.com/user/miked1957_photo/media/photo4_zps851ff81c.jpg.html)

[badass350x]

Any time you want to remove those bearings, grab a long enough piece of all thread to go through one side of the swinger to the other of acceptable size, put a socket on one end that's the same size of the bearing leaving enough thread to put a washer and nut on, then go back to the other side put a nut an washer on it , keeping it all straight crank down on that nut pressing the bearings out, do the opposite to press the new bearings in..Very simple and no damage to anything!!

[Qdude79]

Mrs. Clean here, I took this photo today getting some tires ready for atctim!! Recognize the counter and the kitchen!! :naughty:

http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk179/miked1957_photo/photo4_zps851ff81c.jpg (http://s280.photobucket.com/user/miked1957_photo/media/photo4_zps851ff81c.jpg.html)

Mr. Clean... no offense, but your wife is hairy! And she fits in a tire. Strange. Is PETA aware of this relationship??:wondering

[El Camexican]

Mrs. Clean here, I took this photo today getting some tires ready for atctim!! Recognize the counter and the kitchen!! :naughty:

Got to say, pretty impressed. Does he let you cook in his shop?:wondering

[Qdude79]

Any time you want to remove those bearings, grab a long enough piece of all thread to go through one side of the swinger to the other of acceptable size, put a socket on one end that's the same size of the bearing leaving enough thread to put a washer and nut on, then go back to the other side put a nut an washer on it , keeping it all straight crank down on that nut pressing the bearings out, do the opposite to press the new bearings in..Very simple and no damage to anything!!

Thank you, sir! Don't know what must've happened during powder, maybe the heating process, but those collars popped out like pimples on a 14 year old. WAY easier than when I tried previously.

Used your method given as a way to press the new bushings in! Left one went in with just a bit of coaxing, the right one was a female dog that took some serious torquing. Either way, mission accomplished! Thanks.

[Mr. Clean]

Mr. Clean... no offense, but your wife is hairy! And she fits in a tire. Strange. Is PETA aware of this relationship??:wondering

LOL, Mrs. Clean now has her own 3ww account, she posted that pic under her account!!!

Did you get that collar removed from the swingarm??

[Qdude79]

I did! Heat is the key, apparently.

[RIDE-RED 250r]

Hello Mrs. Clean and welcome to the club! :beer :)

[Mrs. Clean]

Got to say, pretty impressed. Does he let you cook in his shop?:wondering


LOL no way.





Hello Mrs. Clean and welcome to the club! :beer :)

Thanks Joe, been shipping lots of parts your way lately!!!

[RIDE-RED 250r]

LOL no way.






Thanks Joe, been shipping lots of parts your way lately!!!


Yes Ma'am!

It's been nothing short of an absolute pleasure doing business with my new friends I have yet to meet down yonder in Surprise AZ! :beer

[kevink]

Whoever mentioned the threaded 3/8 rod w/washers to extract and install bushings sounds like the most intelligent one on here yet. It is by far the best method yet and there is no hammering, bashing, digging or scoring anything. Just a nice even steady push out then a nice even steady pull in. 2 thumbs up to the person who suggested that.