ATC 250SX voltage

[fabiodriven]

So I ride my SX about once a month or so but sometimes it will sit for 2 months or more in a stretch. Usually the electric start doesn't work the first time I go to crank it up, but it does charge up after riding and will work for the rest of the day.

Today I started the bike up with the kicker and it's running fine. The battery seems especially dead this time, so I put a volt meter to the battery terminals while the bike was running. Now, I was under the assumption that this is a 12 volt system, correct? If this is true, why am I reading 6.4 volts at the battery while the bike is running? Shouldn't it be putting 12v to the battery while running?

Also, I spent the extra coin on the higher-grade battery when I bought it about a year ago. Dirtcrasher told me he doesn't bother with batteries anymore because he couldn't get one to last over a year. What's the deal with these batteries not lasting? I need to run a battery because I'm trying to save the abuse on the one way clutch (or whatever the fack that thing is) and I also run hand warmers and a thumb warmer. I can't be riding around letting my nice, supple, girlish hands getting getting cold.

Is a battery tender a good idea?

[ezmoney1979]

Is a battery tender a good idea?

I have been using one on my 450. It works great. It used to just crank over a few times then click if I let it sit for a few months. Nothing better than a fast cranking starter when you let them sit for a while.

[RIDE-RED 250r]

Fab, yes a battery tender is a good idea. It will apply a low amperage trickle charge to the battery when needed and automatically shut off when the battery is at peak charge. I'm no electrical expert but I know enough to be dangerous.. Ideally, the best charge you can put to a battery is with the lowest amperage you have time to wait for.

I have no earthly idea why non OEM motorcycle/ATV batteries seem to have a much shorter service life than thier OEM counterparts. I have had the same experience myself with that issue. About all you can do IMHO to maximize service life is to periodically check fluid levels in each of the cells and add distilled water as necessary. If a cell ever gets low enough to expose the lead or whatever heavy metal inards in each cell to air, in my experience that has been the death nell to a battery.

Again, not being an electrical theory expert... IMHO with the engine running you should see around 13v at the terminals. But, it is possible that when you battery is down and drawing harder on the charging system the voltage could read lower?? (Someone please feel free to correct me on that) But the fact that after riding it for awhile you can then get anough charge to the batt to use the elec start tells me your charging system is functional.

Here is a possible reason you are getting low voltage readings.... If you have one or two battery cells that have less than the minimum amount of water/acid in them that could effect your voltage readings???

Bottom line: A battery tender and periodic check of fluid levels in the battery cells would go a long way in keeping your e-start system in working order for you. Also, if you can store your SX where it stays warm that would be all the better....

[Jason125m]

There is a reason why boats and dump trailers use deep cycle batterys. You're typical cheap aftermarket battery is made to be charged once and maintained on that same charge from regularr use. Hondas batterys are deep cycle batterys, they are made to be killed, charged, killed, charged, killed charge, and will never wear out. But, I still don't know the difference... I have a simple answer, RIDE MORE :)

[fabiodriven]

All very good info boys. I'm going to get a trickle charger.

Jason, that's some really good info on the OEM batteries being deep-cycles. That actually makes a lot of sense.

I can't check the fluid level in the battery because it's sealed.

[RIDE-RED 250r]

I never knew that either Jason. Thanks for the tip. :beer

That might explain why the OEM battery in my 88 Quadrunner lasted 15 years...

[fabiodriven]

15 years? Jeepers. I'm surprised the Quadrunner made it past 10.

I just ordered a solar trickle charger. I can mount it outside of my garage and the thing should pay for itself in 20 years or so.

[RIDE-RED 250r]

15 years? Jeepers. I'm surprised the Quadrunner made it past 10.I just ordered a solar trickle charger. I can mount it outside of my garage and the thing should pay for itself in 20 years or so.

LOL!

It has had an incredibly easy life. It belonged to my grandmother since brand new before I got it. It rarely saw anything higher than 3rd gear... till I got it. LOL! It's a nice little comfy riding back-forty putt-putt. Good trainer for my kids coming up through too.

[wonderboy]

Hey Fabio,

If your battery has an internal short, it could be drawing more amps than your charging system can put out, thus the voltage drops.

Try to measure the voltage while reving up the motor and see what it reads. Also, not that it may make a difference, but make sure your main fuse isn't blown.

I dropped the coin on the "OEM Honda" replacement battery for my SX. It also doesn't really want to hold a charge if left for a long time. I agree, today's batteries just don't seem to last.

I agree though that the battery tenders are a very good idea.

[fabiodriven]

Thanks for that info Wonderboy.

I put the battery on a charge for about 2 hours and it was reading barely 12 volts while on the charger. I then put the battery back into the SX and got a nice, bright neutral light but when I hit the start button I got next to nothing. I guess these batteries just won't make it past a year without a trickle charge on them.

Jason, I tried looking into the OEM battery (Yuasa YTX12-BS) to see if it was indeed a deep-cycle, but I couldn't come up with anything telling me those are deep cycle. Are you sure about that?

[Scootertrash]

As others have said get a battery tender. Batteries will not hold a charge if left sitting. The main reason peoples batteries fail in what they consider to be a short time is lack of maintaining a charge.

No disrespect to Jason125m but I doubt that Honda uses deep cycle batteries for it's machines. I would like to see the info to back this up. If it's a deep cycle battery it should be labeled as such do to the difference in each type of battery

Deep cycle and Starting or SLI (Start/Lights/Ignition) batteries are two different types of batteries. According to the info below you would need a Deep Cycle battery 20% larger than the normal SLI battery to make up for the lack of cranking amps in a Deep Cycle battery.




What are the differences between a starting and deep cycle battery?

Generally speaking there are two different types of lead acid battery, Starting and Deep Cycle. If a starting battery is routinely deep cycled (discharged below 20%-50% of max capacity) it will generally fail after 30-150 cycles. The same starting battery will last for thousands of cycles if it is just used normally (2% - 5% discharge).

A starting battery is generally designed to start some form of internal combustion engine (car, truck, boat etc). In a starting battery you will find more lead plates, thinner and often made of a lead “sponge” similar looking to a foam sponge. This sort of arrangement means that the plates have much more surface are in the solution than a Deep Cycle battery and allow them to draw larger currents much quicker than a Deep Cycle battery.

A deep cycle battery on the other hand has much thicker plates and they are solid, not sponge. These thicker plates have less surface area and thus less of the instant power that a starting battery needs. They are designed to be discharged down to 20% of their maximum charge repetitively. The thicker lead plates allow for this as they are much sturdier than their sponge counterparts.

Cold Cranking Amps (CCA) is an indicator of the amount of current a battery can deliver for 30 seconds at zero degrees Fahrenheit without dropping below a specified cutoff voltage (normally 10.5 volts). The cranking amps a battery can produce changes with temperature. The warmer it is the more Cranking Amps a battery will produce.

You can use a Deep Cycle battery as a starting battery provided that you take into account the lower CCA of a Deep Cycle battery. As a rule of thumb it’s a good idea to upsize the battery by about 20% to deliver the same amount of cranking amps from a deep cycle battery. Also the self discharge rate of Sealed batteries is a lot less than flooded lead acid types.

Bottom line: keep your battery fully charged, best way is to use a battery tender. Plug it in and forget it, kind of like how people forget about their battery until they want to use the vehicle. ;)

[Scootertrash]

Jason, I tried looking into the OEM battery (Yuasa YT12X-BS) to see if it was indeed a deep-cycle, but I couldn't come up with anything telling me those are deep cycle. Are you sure about that?

A Deep Cycle battery will be labeled "Deep Cycle". See the info I posted above about the differences in batteries. ;)

[Big Mike]

My SX is the same way Fabio, but I dont have the kicker back up. So I usually will put the trickle charger on it, about a week before I plan to use to bring the battery back up. I wish they had better life. My motorcycle battery sucks just as bad as the SX bad if not worse, I cant let it sit more than 2-3 days before it is dead too. BATTERIES TODAY SUCK!!!! Since I started riding bikes, I have had to replace the battery every year in every bike except my 03 Suzuki SV (Since it didnt even live a year :( !! )

[fabiodriven]

Yup, a trickle charger it is. I figure I'll mount the solar panel outside and hard wire a wall plug for it somewhere. That way I can do the SX, the XL, the Buell, the tractor, or whatever else needs it.

[Jason125m]

The Honda battery is not labeled deep cycle because it is not a deep cycle. I used the term deep cycle because I know everyone knows why a deep cycle is good. A few months ago I was talking to my honda dealer ( est 1970 ) and he told me their batterys are designed for being able to be recharged many time, unlike aftermarket, crap. I guess I should of explained more throroughly, but I was on my phone on my way to work. ( Lol ) infact, I'm on my phone on my way home...

I apoligize if I am wrong, I am just taking old mans dunfords word.

[RIDE-RED 250r]

Maybe "severe duty" would be a more applicable description??

I do know there is a difference between "economy" and lifetime warrantee wheel bearing assemblies for vehicles. I'm sure you can get good batteries vs economy batteries as well.

[Keepah Rolln]

I have not had a problem with my honda oem battery on my sx yet...Always stayed charged for the past 5 plus years..Knock on wood....I usually only start it once or twice a month except for ice fishing season i use it 2-3 times a week...