Hard to start with key,but starts with 3 kick.

[BIGREDFREAKE250]

guys, iv been haveing a problem with my 250es,if it sits for a few weeks and you go and try to start it with the key it wont start.but when you kick start it,it will s
start with 2-3 kick, im just wondering if any of yall had this happen?:wondering

[tri again]

You mean like a dead battery type situation?

Always good idea to clean all contacts periodically.
Battery terminals, solenoid and frame ground.

They will start and run without a battery just for info.

Nt a bad idea to check battery voltage while it's running to
make sure your charging stuff is all intact.

Can you click on:

service manual

Pls let us know what you find.

[BIGREDFREAKE250]

no, battery is fully charge,turns over nice and fast,but wont fire,but as soons as i kick start it 2-3 times it fires right up,then when you turn it off it will then fire up with the electric start,

[tri again]

no, battery is fully charge,turns over nice and fast,but wont fire,but as soons as i kick start it 2-3 times it fires right up,then when you turn it off it will then fire up with the electric start,

wow
That sounds more like what the 200es models are famous for.
Intermittent electrical gremlins.

so to review, e start doesn't always fire it up but spins nice and fast?
Is your neutral ligh on nice and bright?
ok, and then you kick it a couple times and it kick starts,
and then shut it off and it will start with the electric starter??

on the 250 es there's a weird fuse that looks like a tiny wrench that easily gets corroded
down by the solenoid in a rubber boot held in with 2 little phillips screws.
and then the neutral safety switch could be keeping it from starting.
Not sure if the neutral safe switch keeps the starter from spinning
(which makes sense) or if it just keeps it from throwing spark so you don't start in gear .

I bet someone knows for sure.
My head is just pounding with some sort of fever flu stuff so it's hard to think clearly
but those are the 2 weak links I remember other than
loose connection somewhere.
Maybe try to nip the last little bit off the coil wire so the spark plug cap has fresh
copper strands to screw into.

THAT has been an epidemic on my machines lately and shows as the weirdest
non-sensical stuff.
The e start may draw just a little extra juice but the kick start gives it enough to
fire.

try that
service manual
or search key.

I think it has a flow chart type troubleshooting section.
and please,
let us know what you find.
Any one of us could be next.

[ailll1]

My SX is doing the exact same thing when its getting really cold outside. Lets say I rode it in AM(wont start with e-start) and come back later during PM, it will start with the e-start even if the engine is completly cold.

I'm thinking it has something to do with these bikes having a starter jet thats too small. Maybe the kickstart gives the motor a little bit more rotating speed than the starter which would allow it to start with a leaner fuel/air ratio.

My dads TRX400 do something similar. It will start with e-start but will take a good amount of revolution for the engine to start. With the pull rope, it starts 1st pull everytime.

I always thought that pull ropes and kickstarts were making it easier to start, so that make sense to me...

[dustrunner]

we have a 85 br and it did the same thing. a few months went buy and the starter died, we bought a new one and have never had a problem with it ever sence = that was 11 years ago... good luck....

[tri again]

aaah Ha!
I thought it was a no spark condition for some reason.

Yeah, the Keihin QA01 carbs had a cold start issue.
Cold start jet was too small.
I cleaned / reamed mine and it was enough to open it up.
Actually, just by trying the recall bulletin with the sheet metal screw to pull it out, opened it up enough.
I never did get the jet out.

I've also heard of an actual drill size that works but safest to get the right size number.

I've also rocked the trike side to side almost violently to get gas sloshing,
keep a spark plug on the woodstove so it's already hot,
hate to use ether but used to until I fixed it.

With the kicker, you can roll it around to the compression stroke and a couple quick hits
and it will fire.

How easily we (i) forget the nightmares.
I almost quit using that one in the winter.

side note: yeah, I remember a 200es that would NOT throw spark with the elec start, no way no how and as I walked away from it for the LAST freakin' time, I pulled the rope out of morbid curiosity, and the plug sparked. Guess that was the flashbacks I was having.
Never did figure that one out.
Traded all the 84 models for 85 es and sx's.

[jadleybray]

A shot of starting fluid on the filter won't hurt a thing. Hold the throttle wide open, hit the filter with a 1 second shot. Good to go. The alky motors can be a trailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro to start after purging, better than kicking it for 30 minutes.

[Flyingw]

You've probably seen my thread selling rebuilt ES/SX carbs. Part of what I do when I rebuild these carbs is remove the cold start jet and drill it. I too had difficulties getting the cold start jet out. I screw the sheetmetal screw in about 1/2-3/4 turn. I lay a thick shank screwdriver across the jet stack as a pivot. I then took a screwdriver (flat) and cut a slot in the center of it to go around the screw so I can get it up under the head. Then I just lever the jet right out. I drill the jet with a .080mm micro drill and reassemble. I hope this helps you guys. I have rebuilt carbs sitting on my shelf if you need one.

[tri again]

Thanks fw
I had such good leverage that I was afraid to break the carb body
but just the screw damage was enough to open that jet so it starts beautifully like all the others.

Thats for the .080mm info
MM? right? not thousandths.
I love to have one of those fw carbs but I don't seem to need one at this moment.
Of course, that never stopped me before.

What's a rough price with an unknown condition, but complete core returned?
Do you need the choke cable with plunger?
I was either dreaming or actually saw choke plunger replacements somewhere.

I also know that some of those plungers had a square cut 'o' ring and some have no seal.

[Flyingw]

Ya. 0.80 mm drill. The cost is 100.00 with exchange and 125.00 no exchange. There are aftermarket plunger kits on ebay for about 20.00. I have plungers if you need one. The 85 was a straight brass barrel but the 86/87s had an oring in the middle of the barrel. Either one works. Dont worry about the screw damaging the jet. The one I pulled out today had more than a full turn on the screw. The screw does distort the end of the jet but it doesn't effect the metering hole so I hit it with a file to clean it up. The micro drill is chucked up in my Dremmel. Just oversize the hole and blow it out. tap it back untill it stops moving and you're done. Be very gentle when drilling. The micro drills break easy. I have a local tool store I got my drills. I think I paid like 10 bucks for a set. If you have trouble finding drills, let me know and I can stop and pickup a set and mail them to you but like I said, I use my Dremmel with a small chuck collar in it.

[just ben]

wow 80 thousands of a mm? areyou sure its not .8mm?

[Flyingw]

Opps..... My bad. 0.80mm. (corrected in the post above)

[BIGREDFREAKE250]

ok thanks.

we will look into the jet problem.