Fu*%$(g allen head screws!!!!

[JasonB]

SO I would like to request that Honda reconsider the use of Allen head screws on the sprocket and brake hubs on the 250R's. I cant seem to free like 5 of the 8 bolts on the rear that hold the brake rotor to the hub or the sprocket to the hub.

For starters I am looking to just outright BUY a new set of both hubs, does anyone has a pair WITHOUT the sprocket and rotors attached? second, and I need to look closely at this again, but can I just run a normal hex head bolt in place of these damned allen key head screws?! WTF HONDA :mad:

need em for an 86. I needs em soon. Thanks :cool:

[El Camexican]

??? Socket caps screws (the proper term) ROCK!!! I use them on everything.
If you have problems try this:
1. Use Metric keys, not "almost the right size" Imperial keys.
2. Try tightening them before you try losening them, as it will often break them free.
3. A straight whack with a hammer (and I know you have one of those for every day of the week) on the head before trying to move them can help as well, just don't get nuts and bust something.
4. Heat works on these too.
5. Always put a dab of anti-size when using a stainless bolt in an aluminiun thread.
6. When using loctite use the blue, not the red if you ever plan to take the bolt out again.

[Dirtcrasher]

Jason, I put a little heat on them threaded portion, seems to help.

As soon as you feel the wrench doing nothing, take a larger size hex wrench and grind it to a bit of a taper so I can SMASH the key in there.

That usually does it :D

Good luck bud.

[110klt]

I do tend to agree. Socet head screws ROCK...... Used them when I built my 383 chevy stroker, never had trouble.



??? Socket caps screws (the proper term) ROCK!!! I use them on everything.
If you have problems try this:
1. Use Metric keys, not "almost the right size" Imperial keys.
2. Try tightening them before you try losening them, as it will often break them free.
3. A straight whack with a hammer (and I know you have one of those for every day of the week) on the head before trying to move them can help as well, just don't get nuts and bust something.
4. Heat works on these too.
5. Always put a dab of anti-size when using a stainless bolt in an aluminiun thread.
6. When using loctite use the blue, not the red if you ever plan to take the bolt out again.

[El Camexican]

I do tend to agree. Socet head screws ROCK...... Used them when I built my 383 chevy stroker, never had trouble.

Amen Bro, they are a God send when compared to those Philips head bolts that most Jap bikes come with. I've never figured out how they make them so soft, but I think they have a 15% margarine content.

[falloutboy]

I'm pretty sure those have loctite on them. Lots of heat is the key...

[DasUberKraut]

El Camexican. I hate to break it to ya bro, but there is NO such thing as a socket cap screw. It's a hex bolt or hex screw. Thus requiring a hex key aka Allen wrench. Sorry bro.

[Dirtcrasher]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, there are allen bolts called a flat head tapered socket head cap screws; 82 degrees.

I believe he has tapered screws he's trying to get out. They clear the sprocket and caliper.

[DasUberKraut]

I stand corrected.

[just ben]

I have had my issues with the flat socket heads myself. The taper is what gets locked up. when all else fails I drill a small pilot hole about half way through the bolt,then use a larger drill size (5/16) for an 8mm bolt drill until the head spins off. Then spin it out with an easy out. they usually come out with almost not effort.

[El Camexican]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_screw_drives

Interesting reading for the morning coffee. Seems you can call a bolt that accepts a hex headed wrench (AKA Allen wrench) a few things. The term Allen bolt always irks me though and makes me think of people that call all snowmobiles Ski-Doos

Bottom line is that young Jason needs to break the crud, Loctite and tension on his bolts and heat and proper fitting wrenches are the key as has been stated. I'm going to put a post up on this subject.

[JasonB]

hahahahha this got out of hand to say the least! Thanks for input guys, I am searching for a set of hubs to buy. My impacts are just spining the screws at this point; the nuts are locked onto the screws which are free in their holes. F THIS, im throwing my brake rotor and hub in the trash! ok not really just frustrated with it! I have a new rear rotor to replaced the cracked stocker with and want t do it asap. I have new sprockets to install too :*(

I was really looking to see if there are alternatives to these screws, like say a comon house hold BOLT hahahaha I think I need to find a tapered sleeve that will fit into the sprocket and rotors. I havent looked closely but I assume they need to be centered using those 'allen bolts'.

[El Camexican]

Help for next time is on the way....

[JasonB]

Help for next time is on the way....

??????? como?

[SWIGIN]

The problem with the sprocket bolts are that some guys seem to try to tighten/loosen them buy the bolt head. The smart way to attach is by tightening/loosening by using the 17mm nut and just use the bolt head to keep the bolt from turning.

Rotor bolts are super easy IF they have not been messed up by someone not using the correct method of removal. I always use my air gun to remove/install these little suckers and have never ruined one.

[JasonB]

i like that idea of using a drill to drill out the center of the screw and the a bigger bit and then using an easy out to hold the bastards still while I hammer on them with my impact.

I still need to inspect them closer; can I use just new metric bolts in the screws place since the opennings on them dont (IIRC) seem to require the tappered screwes to center anything. or do they?

[tecat-z]

The problem with the sprocket bolts are that some guys seem to try to tighten/loosen them buy the bolt head. The smart way to attach is by tightening/loosening by using the 17mm nut and just use the bolt head to keep the bolt from turning.

Rotor bolts are super easy IF they have not been messed up by someone not using the correct method of removal. I always use my air gun to remove/install these little suckers and have never ruined one.

Bingo... You got it right. This method of attachment has been used for decades on motorcycles both dirt and street before the advent of floating disks. It is however still the most widely used way of attaching rear sprockets even today due to the narrow space requiring flush fit hardware. As stated, the allen is ONLY used for "holding".