Serious Mud proofing, Race event

[TrailerRider]

Ok so for the first year here in Oroville the Surplus City Mudd and Crawl is going to have an ATV mud race event Main Site

(http://www.cj-jeep.com/)and Offical Rules PDF Required (http://www.cj-jeep.com/Events/4x4-Shows-2011/April2011/PDF/Rule%20&%20Class%20for%20ATV.pdf). There is

nothing in the rules that say you can't run a 3 wheeler.

Now it is to late this year to enter but I am going to next year. Maybe I can lay the smack down on the 2wd quads.

More then likely I will run my 200s cause it has always been my mudd queen. So the things I am thinking about are as follows:

Water Proofing:

wireing
Rear end
Front end
Crank case Breather relocation
Snorkle
Carb+cables
Clutch shifter
Exhaust exit relocation higher
Recoil Handle
Chain rear and front

Engine Mods:
carb
Cam
Air Filter

Other:
Gearing to spin rears fast
Clutch
Tire Size rear 22x11.00x8
Rear Fender Half or Full or None
Front tire pressure
Rear Tire pressure
Gas tank Smaller or less gas


I am looking for serious opinions based on as much fact as possible.

[tri again]

dielectric grease on all connectors is oem, I believe.

200s gearing?
easier to use smaller tires? maybe even flatter than rounded type.
and something that throws mud out of the treads. Saw something where a guy
cut some of the cleats away but then one spin might get you buried.

We have mud here we can't even walk on and if you do it will suck your shoes or boots clean off.
That's why we have trikes but never got as serious as the good responses you're gonna get.

I've seen some pretty cool snorkles on here.
Maybe a pluggable drain for the pull start?
RTV the handle down after you start it to keep water out?
You may have to start it once so the seal will break but you also have a race to win right?
How much time will it take to do the run? Minutes?

Now I really want to see what everyone comes up with.

[Chazz of Blades]

The carb from an 86 200x will fit, you will have to use the throttle head(body?Screw? The needle and part that screws in the top of the carb). It gave my high comp, cammed 200S a good bit more low end, and helped on the speed.




I found it was alot easier, and alot better to take the whole thumb throttle from the X and put it on the 200S, it'll require taking a file or something and cutting a small peice off the side of the thumb throttle box, and the small metal nub on the handlebars.


It's COMPLETELY worth it though compared to the stock throttle.

[muthey]

I dont know if you would want to rtv the handle on the off chance it stalls and you have to start it again, maybe grease the rope up, and pack the lip on the handle with grease to keep the liquids out. I remember someone on here saying the 4snow tires worked really well in sand and mud as well as snow because the narrow and get larger the faster they spin. maybe put a 90* elbow on the muffler, and for a front tire I recommend an original ohistu XA-801 tire is excellent for clearing mud. If you don't add hand guards, maybe put grease on your brake levers, grease is actually really good for sealing things up. Dont you have to install a a automatic kill switch on that as well? Add some wheel spacers take off your mud flaps. And possibly a smaller fuel tank so you can get lower for less wind resistance. take off any thing you can withing the rules to lessen your wieght might want to fatten you jets and change your exhaust to add some power in case you don't feel like tearing into the motor.

[acidburn]

u can use 25" tires if u want more clearance i have them on my 185s
http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/208437_10150156708577657_508697656_6862346_1625790 _n.jpg

[TrailerRider]

Great ideas. So far I am running for rears 22x11.00.8 dirt devils in the rear right now and likely thats what I will run. The front is from a 84 200m and huge. It shoudl float well. So using the 86 carb will net some low end grunt which will help spin them in the mudd. What piston you runing and is the cam from an 86 200x? I am currently on my 2nd bore but going a little bigger is ok.

I am thinking about making some rim mudd covers, removable. This should reduce the mudd weight. I have skid plate already. I currently have a answer pipe that flows pretty good. I have taken the head pipe off and cleaned the left over factory slag from the inner part of the pipe, made a good difference too.

What abour race fuel which max for this event is 114. Never considered using it before. Any opinions? What about clutch? I would think the stock clutch would hold up ok for the short runs but with more power weaker things tend to give up.

I think they should seperate the 2 strk and 4 strk classes. Not this year though but maybe next.

[Chazz of Blades]

IIRC compression is 10:1, I don't remember the parts number for the piston, I'm thinking the engine is .30 over.


I would have used the 86 cam, but the second gen cams won't fit a motor like that. You can get either an XR 200 cam, or the cam off of a first gen 200x and it should work.

[Trip]

if you doin all that work.... i would personally replace the clutch with something stronger....last thing u want is the clutch shooting out the side of the motor while you are racen... but...when it comes down to simplicity... need to go fast? lots a mud? more power..bigger tires... water proof the important parts and floor it!

i would also consider a high performance oil ...obviously... as far as racen fuel... it clearly gives more power...so..ehh if you are just trying to run fast and keep it running for the day... i would say throw everything you logically can in it to make it faster and mud proof... make a damn good point stompin 4 wheelers :)

good luck, go get em!

[Chazz of Blades]

Don't run racing fuel.




Unless you have to run high octane, don't. It's just throwing away money. 82 octane hits harder, faster than race gas. Octane just lengthens burn time for high compression motors.


As long as you don't have any predetonation (pinging), run 82, or one step up.

[TrailerRider]

alright I think I got most every covered now. Can someone explain to me what "carb flattening" is? I tried to google and only came up with 1 result from some farmall foum.

[muthey]

fattening the carb would be adding bigger jets to allow more fuel to the motor, sometimes is easier to put in bigger jets than risking buying a ebay 200x carb that might fail right out of the box

[Chazz of Blades]

I actually don't use the X jets in mine, I use a real X carb, with the S jets. With the 110(108?) that was in the X, it bogged down too much.

[Jerm1179]

what about an axle paddle? i dont really play in deep deep mud but i have seen them used and they seem to make a difference....

[Chazz of Blades]

If it's straight mud, then paddles work well, but if you have to cross any rutted terrain, or anything with rocks they become a nuisance.

[HONDA_ATC_FREAK]

I've seen the axle paddles on youtube they look like they work pretty good as long as your not in rut's or rocks.
I'd suggest you go on youtube and search High lifter mud bog. They have a highlifterforum and those guys know everything about mud they do some crazy stuff over there.

[H2Sbass]

I run 25" mudlites on my slightly modified atc 110. Waiting for a bigger sprocket so its kinda gutless right now. But in the mud, I just focus on trying to keep the front end from coming over and the tires do the rest. It's a pretty wild ride, just cat walk and see where you end up.lol. Wish I had some pics.

[H2Sbass]

Btw, as far as mudproofing goes, I have extended the cc breather, added a snorkel with prefilter, and built my exhaust to come out highup when i built my pipe. I've tried sealing the pullstart with grease but if you get into water you end up with grease/water stew in there. Also water/mud ravages axle bearings and I've yet to find a way to successfully seal it up. Good luck on your racing, unfortunantly my local mudbogs don't allow tricycles.

[TrailerRider]

I have some paddles I was going to put on my 200x for the dunes but ended up not having enough time so they are sitting in the garage rafters waiting for a trip out. Might give them a shot is some mud round here and see how they act. I missed the event this year for the atv's by a week :mad:. Trying to find someone around here who ran it or watched it. Usually the surplus city mud track is pretty muddy. They have water trucks filling it up every few races so it gets pretty snotty. No rocks or hard spots that I can see. Mostly thick wet slippery clay mud which is what we have in our area. You know the kind you step in and loose your shoes... So having a tred pattern that will self clean is imperative. The rears I have currently have been ridden through really thick mud and they do pretty well. Do the stock knobbies on front self clean pretty well?

Anyone have any suggestions as to rear sprockets? Again the mudd around here is red clay that is sticky so I need some serious wheel spin that can handle the 22 tires in the rear. I have also been thinking about resurrecting the fwd idea I had. I had a motor for it but it ended up getting used for another project plus a 6hp in the front is to much weight for a mud racer..:lol:

So the all important question. What should the mud racer be called?

[Chazz of Blades]

The Hippo.

Bog Dog

Mud Masher

[acidburn]

bog hog! lol

[daniel_250r]

first off how deep are we talking? check my vid on youtube of me swimming my 20os real deep. first off i plugged the bottom of the airbox, run the crank case breather up to the bars, dont bother with a snorkel if you are not going over the gas tank, exhaust snorkel is always nice tho the 200s doesnt put out enough pressure to idle under water for long. and put WAX on the pull start rope it will be slick and not break for a long time