ATC125 high clutch engagement...

[unclejemima]

My 1986 ATC125M has a very high clutch engagement. Compared to my 1984 ATC125M, the 86 seems to fully engage its clutch at much higher rpm, and it feels as if I have to rev the piss out of it before shifting so the rpms don't to much. Is this just because it is such a small displacement motor? My 1981 ATC200's clutch engages at a very low rpm, almost off idle. I'm assuming this is because it is (for its time) a big displacement.

Anyway, I'm assuming that my clutch plates are just worn out. Is this what I would replace to cure my problem and lower my clutch engagement rpm? Is this a difficult job to do or something I can do myself?

I found some clutch plates on ebay...will something like this do?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/86-87-Honda-ATC125-M-EBC-clutch-kit_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem56337379c3QQitemZ37 0230393283QQptZMotorcyclesQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

[Vealmonkey]

You have me a little confused here. If your clutch is out of adjustment is one issue. But actual clutch engagement is when you let pressure off of your shifter peg. If you up shift or down shift you engage your clutch and when you let your shifter return to normal it dis-engages the clutch. I think your clutch may need adjustment. If it has no adjustment left, then it needs replaced. And that is pretty much it.

[unclejemima]

Sorry for the confusing post. What I meant is...The ATC125M has an auto clutch, and I can have first gear fully engaged at idle without the machine moving. When I push the throttle, as the RPM's increase the clutch will take up and the trike starts moving. The RPM at when the trike starts moving is what I am referring to as the "clutch engagement point"
Right now it will not start moving until the RPM's are very high, as opposed to engaging right off idle.
I adjusted the clutch with no effect.
What parts are actually replaced when I do the clutch? Just the friction plates...http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?campid=5336526073&toolid=10001&mpre=http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/86-87-Honda-ATC125-M-EBC-clutch-kit_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem56337379c3QQitemZ37 0230393283QQptZMotorcyclesQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
Thanks!

[Vealmonkey]

You can replace just the friction plates. Personally since the chances of you dealing with 25 year old parts are pretty high and the cost isn't all that, I would replace the friction plates and the steels. But it really is kind of what your budget can hold. You may as well get a gasket set and make sure you clean your oil filter screen while you are in there. Now I hope, that you haven't used a modern synthetic oil in your trike as alot of times the synthetic oils seem to be way too slippery for the clutch friction material. So I would just recommend a nice oil formulated for motorcycles that you keep changed regularly.

[fabiodriven]

I would recommended replacing the steels as well as the fibers, unless the steels look really good. Like Vealmonkey said, these are potential 25 year old parts. They've done their time. Look at the steels and see if they appear to be "glazed" or are changing to a blue color. This indicates a very abused clutch and just replacing the fibers is not going to help. If you think a little 125 can't do that to a clutch, think again. My 110 was like that when I bought it. Just picture all the years of kids jumping on that thing and starting off in 2nd or 3rd gear in high range. Bye-bye clutch! The other thing you have to do is place the steels on a surface plate or some other surface that you are sure is perfectly flat and make sure they aren't warped. If it passes all those tests, then re-use them.

I'm not too familiar with the 2nd gen 125M. Is there any chance they have a centripetal clutch setup like the YTM200? If this question were asked about a YTM200 then the obvious answer would be the centripetal clutch is smoked.

[unclejemima]

Ok, thanks for the reply guys. I've never taken the clutch apart...what are the "steels". Can they be purchased aftermarket as well? Are they expensive?

I'm assuming these (see pic below) are just the fibers. What do the "steels" look like?
http://shindypro.com/catalog/images_l/09-051.jpg

[fabiodriven]

The steels are just smooth metal plates. There is a steel disc in between every fiber. They alternate steel, fiber, steel, fiber, etc. I'm not positive if they make aftermarket steels for that. I usually end up getting OEM steels for some reason, probably because they aren't available aftermarket. It doesn't hurt to check though.

[mopar_man]

Stock clutch fibers are $11.40 each (4 required) and the steels are $4.41 each (3 required) from Powersportspro.com. That's pretty cheap I think.

[unclejemima]

Either of these two kits what I need? Should I replace the springs as well? http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn123/cornflakejoe/ebcclutchkit.jpg

[unclejemima]

Stock clutch fibers are $11.40 each (4 required) and the steels are $4.41 each (3 required) from Powersportspro.com. That's pretty cheap I think.

Oops, just saw this post. I think I will get those. The price is good.

Is this a tough job to do the clutch plates? How many hours of labor would it take to do this job?

Should I replace the springs as well?

[Vealmonkey]

Replace the springs as well, yes. The springs should only be a couple of dollars. You want to make sure you have a gasket kit too. You will be removing the side cover, so you will want to clean up the side cover and the gasket sealing surface on the center case and install a new gasket. And since you will have the side cover off, the oil filter screen is right there and you will want to clean that. If you don't find an oil filter screen, make sure and get one. Make sure and take your time and also make sure to download a shop manual and follow the directions to disassemble and to assemble and you should have no problems. If you have a friend with a "click" type torque wrench, I would borrow that and follow the torque values whenever possible. The engine cases are aluminum and it is very easy to overtighten a bolt and strip the threads out, which is bad. You may need a impact screwdriver to remove your side cover screws. Also you may want to replace the side cover phillips screws with allen bolts. That makes it way easier to torque down and remove the bolts later and they usually look a bit nicer than banged up 25 year old phillips head screws. Remember if you decide to use stainless allen bolts, to put a dab of oil or loctite on the bottom threads to act as a lubricant so the stainless doesn't bind up on the aluminum threads. And if you get frustrated, come on here and ask for advice or an explanation that you can understand. Don't get mad at the trike and beat on it and really break something. And most of all, have fun and learn a little bit.

[fabiodriven]

My ATC 110 is a completely different animal than the 2nd gen 125M, but I was surprised at the difficulty in doing that clutch. I was fine, but somebody with less experience may have had some trouble.

[Howdy]

Oops, just saw this post. I think I will get those. The price is good.

Is this a tough job to do the clutch plates? How many hours of labor would it take to do this job?

Should I replace the springs as well?

wooooaaaaa here a minute!!!!!!!!!!!

The 86-87 125m uses a different style clutch than the older ones ( pictures attatched ). If your clutch doesn't engage until high rpm's then your centifical clutch is the problem. The 86-87 125m's use 2 clutches ( manual and centrifical ). It is a very simular set up to the 1980-86 185-200 Honda motors. The centrifical clutch is the clutch that engages with engine RPM. If the centrifical clutch disk and or drum are wore they won't engage until higher RPM's. And this is the problem you said you had in your fist posting, so I am 100% your centrifical clutch and or drum is wore out.

As far as the manual clutch goes: If the disk are original then it wouldn't hurt to replace them while you have the right cover off. If the springs are in tolerance then they don't need replaced.

I can assure you this info is 100% correct because I have a friend that owns a 86 125m runner ( nice ), 1 parts machine, and 2 trx125's ( 87-88 which use the same motor).

[unclejemima]

The 86-87 125m uses a different style clutch than the older ones.

If your clutch doesn't engage until high rpm's then your centifical clutch is the problem.

Good to know!!!
Do I have to replace the entire centrifugal clutch unit or are there replacement parts to rebuild it? Does anyone make an aftermarket replacement or only OEM?
Thanks for the kind info and catching that before I got to far in!

[mopar_man]

Do I have to replace the entire centrifugal clutch unit or are there replacement parts to rebuild it? Does anyone make an aftermarket replacement or only OEM?

From the same source as above, the centrifugal weights are $54 (set of 3). The clutch drum SHOULD be OK but if it's not, it's $118. If you need a new drum and don't want to fork out that kind of money, the '87-'88 TRX125 has the same clutch drum. The weights are also the same. I'm not sure where you got your EBC listing above but there are aftermarket companies out there that make the weights. I would suggest Parts Unlimited but they recently changed their online catalog and it sucks balls so I can't tell you if they have anything to fit your machine. If you go to their website, you may have a dealer nearby who will have a paper catalog that is much easier to search through.

[fabiodriven]

wooooaaaaa here a minute!!!!!!!!!!!

The 86-87 125m uses a different style clutch than the older ones ( pictures attatched ). If your clutch doesn't engage until high rpm's then your centifical clutch is the problem. The 86-87 125m's use 2 clutches ( manual and centrifical ).

I had a feeling about that...

[unclejemima]

The clutch drum SHOULD be OK but if it's not, it's $118.
Is the clutch drum a wear part? (aka, will it wear over time and need replacement like clutch discs?)

[Howdy]

Is the clutch drum a wear part? (aka, will it wear over time and need replacement like clutch discs?)

Yes, it can and does wear. Normally the clutch disk wear the most, but I have seen some really bad drums. You really can't be sure what all will need replaced until you open up the motor and pull the clutch (s) off.
Howdy